It started! oil shower from hydraulics; engine wouldn't stop

[bnmccoy]

Got all the wiring completed, filled her with fresh antifreeze coolant. Decided to see if she would start using the heater and primer.

Last time I started her was 6-10 months ago. That was after installing a new injection pump diaphragm; fuel tank cleaned and lined; a fuel filter assy; and a starter. Ran it a minute and shut it off and then restarted it and ran it 4 or 5 minutes.

So back to tonight. Tractor is in my garage attached to house. Rear tires are shot and won't hold air so rear of tractor is up on jack stands.

Well I hold the heater button for 40 seconds and then crank her over and push the primer button; didn't start first time. Tried again and she started right up. But something is seriously wrong, there is oil spraying straight up from right side of tractor seat; exactly where from I couldn't see. I pull the stop cable to stop engine but it doesn't stop. I shut the fuel off. I throw an old rag on top of the showering oil. I try operating lever on injection pump with my hand, then a long screw driver. I go in house and yell to get ready to call fire department and grap a fire extinguisher. Oil is burning on exhaust pipe and manifold. Garage is full of smoke and oil vapor.

What they (wife and daughter) hear is; "call the fire department."

The engine finally dies; wife comes out, I hear fire engine sirens, the police are out front.... Fire truck shows up; they take information, survey scene, etc, and leave. They were concerned about me being saturated in oil.

The garage is a two car garage. The roll up garage door was open and basically above the tractor. It was dripping oil all over. 1/3 of my garage was sprayed; walls, ceiling, etc. Lots of stuff totally ruined; rest will take days to clean. 1/4 inch of oil on floor surrounding the tractor. Tractor covered in oil. Me covered in oil. Threw away my shirt and after long shower and lots of scrubbing get oil out of hair and off of me.

The stop cable is only moving about 1 inch; which is all lever on injection pump will move. When I changed diaphragm I found the linkage stuck and un-stuck it; I think there is a problem there.

I didn't even think to slow the engine with the throttle; it was at mid point; brain not working too good in panic mode. I could have pulled the pre cleaner and blocked the inlet too; but, likewise my brain just wasn't functioning while getting showered by oil.

I haven't touched the back part of the tractor although I have a supply of oil for changing same. I don't know where the high pressure oil was coming from. Fixing to look at manual and see what the round circular cover on side of case (below right side of seat) is as that is suspect in my eyes.

At least it started without any ether And better yet I didn't burn the house down. My only injury seems to be a burn to my hand trying to move the stop lever on the pump. Hopefully inhaling all the smoke and vapor will not have any long term effect on me. This tractor has the exhaust pipe that goes down and sweeps to the rear of tractor rather than the vertical exhaust.

Went to Walmart and bought several bags of floor dry; spread two bags out on floor to control the oil. Wiped as much oil off of tractor as I could with towels. Will start the cleanup tomorrow


Bob

[bnmccoy]

I'm all ears for any suggestions regarding the stop cable linkage; and the source of the hydraulic spray....

I have fresh oil for the transmission and rear gear case; but that wasn't how I was planning to get the old oil out...

Bob

[henk]

Hello Bob,

You made a big enter in the world of Fordson and on this forum.
Glad you and your family are all right.
All the best with the cleaning up.
I hope no big damage is done on the Dexta.

[Brian]

Bob,

Welcome to the joys of owning an old tractor.

1. If you have fitted the diaphram to the pump, did you get everything back correctly? The stop mechanism works on the same shaft and you should be able to move the lever easily, even with the cable connected.

2. High pressure hydraulic oil? Down by the right leg? Well the good news is the pump is working. The pump is the round disc near your ankle. The oil comes up from here and into the lift under your right thigh. If the oil was going straight up, it is possible that a plug has been left out of the hydraulic plate on the top of the lift. If it was going sideways it is possibly a blown "O" ring. Neither of which are very serious.

3. Would not worry too much about the fumes. You got out into the air. They are not very pleasent but neither was some of the other fumes that were inhaled (or not according to Bill Clinton) in the 1960's.

I have breathed them in countless times (cough, cough) and am still here. (Diesel and oil fumes that is). It was a common thing every morning to come out of the tractor shed in a cloud of blue/grey smoke with eyes streaming when you drove a Field Marshall single cylinder, two stroke diesel.

No harm done but please take care. These tractors have no feelings and can kill easily, No matter how we treat them they are still a lump of unfeeling metal!

Emergency stop? Try a plastic bag over the air cleaner intake.

[bnmccoy]

I initially replaced the diaphragm because many years ago when the tractor first quit, the father-in-law said he had replaced it once before for same problem; which at that time was engine would run wide open with no governor. So he quit using it and it set out in the open for several years; someone robbed the alternator; the good rear tires got moved to other tractors; the fuel tank filled with water; the oil bath filled with water as no precleaner on top. So she sat out there neglected for many years.

I initially thought that a new diaphragm would be all the tractor would need to get her going. Then it wouldn't crank as starter no longer worked. Then it became an issue of knowing when to stop repairing things.

Anyway when I changed the diaphragm I found the internal linkage stuck in what would be max fuel mode of governor. I don't think there was anything wrong with diaphragm but I destroyed it getting it out as someone used sealant to install it. I managed to get linkage free and could not get it to stick so figured good to go. I have since noted in the parts diagrams there should be a small clip securing the diaphragm which was not present when i replaced it.

Looks like I will be taking another look at the governor internal linkage.

A few months later I did start the tractor and stopped it twice; and no hydraulic fluid spraying!

I haven't removed anything from the pump cover or any of the hydraulics for that matter. but suspect something in that area is wrong. I'll take a closer look at what you pointed out though.

Thanks for suggestions. I had made a couple of posts on the old forum regarding starter questions; but have been lurking ever since getting good information.

Thanks,

Bob

[Grani]

I am not a Dexta expert but some things that comes to mind is that if it has a thermostart is can perhaps cause a uncontrolled run if it is leaking fuel in the inlet manifold. If it has a pneumatic governor an you switch the pipes the motor run out of control and the stoplever can be hard to pull back. With the pto lever in off position the oilspray is not possible, so you can fix the engine problem first and the oilspray then. But as I said I am not a Dexta expert.

[bnmccoy]

I believe that what I read in the manual is that the hydraulic pump runs with or without PTO engaged.

The engine didn't really run away; the stop lever on the injection pump is not fully moving all the way is what I think. The engine just did not stop. It does have the pneumatic governor.

New radiator, new thermostat, hoses, coolant, etc.

I've been gone last few days on final RV camping trip for this year prior to final winterization of the RV. Have spent one day cleaning in garage and cleaning other stuff in garage. I have a large bucket I've been throwing my tools for cleaning last. I have quite a bit more cleaning before I can get back to work on the tractor. I'll pull the governor cover first and see what was going on there; then I believe the hydraulic pump cover is the actual source of the leak which should be easily confirmed once the cover is removed.

I plan to pull it out in the driveway when I decide to again start it; once I believe I have corrected the hydraulic pressure leak.

She will be getting a wash in the driveway first though. She is still dripping oil; oil is still dripping from my overhead door too. She was probably upset I wasn't using the correct blue paint!

I'll post what I find once I get back to working on the tractor instead of cleaning up my mess which is first priority right now.

Bob

[Brian]

You are right about the hydraulic pump, it drives before the PTO on the Dexta and you also only have one vacuum pipe.

The oil leak must have been a pressure leak to squirt around as you say. It might be best, when you get the stop working, to crank her over on the starter with it pulled so that the engine does not fire, and identify where the oil is coming from. The only place it can come from is the top plate on the lift as the oil from the pump comes into this before going anywhere else.

[bnmccoy]

I plan to do things as you suggested Brian.

I got the new rear tires on her today so I could roll her in the driveway for a bath! Lots of cleaning and washing of the oil bath.

Looking at service manual tonight and then realized that the pump on the side is not just a cover but the pump; which meant the oil couldn't have been spraying from that gasket.

Best I can figure is the oil must have been shooting to the right and hitting something (fender or qualitrol depth adj, etc) which deflected it straight up.

I have cranked her over with starter and don't see any oil shooting; (might not be any left:)).

Now that she is cleaned up, I'll get the stop cable working first so when I do start her, I can stop her. Plus I can push her out in the driveway just in case..... the oil comes flying. I'll also have a heavy cloth to through over the spray to minimize the spray.

Still cleaning tools, equipment, and junk in the garage of the oil....

Bob

[bnmccoy]

Rolled the tractor out in the driveway last weekend. After a little cranking and purging the air from the fuel lines (since I had stopped it by turning off the fuel at the tank) she started up.

Interesting thing is that I had previously cranked her on several occassions hoping to identify the source of the oil from the hydraulics and nothing sprayed. While out in the drive and cranking, before she started I found the source of the leak. It was from the hydraulic pump where it bolts to the side of the rear case. Dumb me, I did not realize there was an O-Ring in there from the relief valve passage to pass the high pressure oil back to the tractor.

I have since removed the pump and the top of the case and I am awaiting some gaskets and O-Rings. I purchased a gasket kit for the top; but, guess I'll have to make the pump gasket and source the O-Ring myself.

The engine idled so smoothly with the new governor, proper working oil bath filter, and new inlet hose.

The oil had pretty much quit spraying so I decided to drive her back into the garage (didn't want to idle too long w/o oil in that pump). As the tractor left my slightly inclined driveway into the level garage the pump picked up some more oil and gave my leg an oil bath:).

Maybe, just maybe, this tractor will be doing some brush hogging this spring......

Sorry for long post, but I frequently read this forum to learn; and wanted to post an update. Hopefully my next update will be I loaded her on the trailer under her own power and took her back to the FIL's place to be ready for some work.

Bob

[bnmccoy]

I actually had the hydraulic leak taken care of back in February, just needed to put right foot rest, seat, etc. back together when the father-in-law passed away. So it was disappointing that he never got to see her running again when I unloaded her from the trailer at his place (15 acres). The wife said my grin was from ear to ear once I got her off the trailer and took her for a ride in the field (never more than from my driveway to the trailer at our house in town).

Did not finish putting her back together till May; didn't know if the lift was going to work properly until then.

The tractor starts right up using the heater, primer as one is suppose to. She idles very nicely and the governor works good too. The stop cable is working too; I make sure it is moving the full distance prior to starting.

I have since used her to mow (bush or brush hog) the 15 acres. The new radiator works nice, she doesn't overheat even when cutting stuff as 2/3 the height of the tractor on one part of the Shark.

I have working head lamps, and a rear flood lamp so have even mowed during the cooler evening hours. The alternator I added is keeping the battery charged.

She could use some more work fixing the brakes to work better, front wheel bearings, king pins, etc; but it all will probably have to wait till Fall.

Thank you very much to all that post even if not directly to this thread as I have read many, many posts to figure things out that I never posted or asked about.

Thanks again,

Bob

[Brian]

Sorry to here about your FIL Bob, but glad to hear you have got the Dexta running OK. Glad to have helped, now have fun!