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590E engine date and Thames Trader compliance

PostPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 3:39 am
by 1962 model
Hello everyone,
I have a couple of conflicting dates that I would like to sort out.

The 590E engine that I want to fit to my Fordson Super Major came from a Thames Trader, the Trader compliance plate has the photo etch writing missing but the first line has;

8BM.10.61 76 2495

second line; 000 27 3261R

By this I thought that the 8 was for Australian build, BM may be for the Broad Medows factory in Melbourne, 10th month 1961, no Idea of the rest.

However from some of the date information available the engine was not produced until 1962?

The engine code is B 1 F

Yet other information quotes that F is 1961 this would make the engine cast Feb 1st 1961 which makes it three months before the truck was built, A bit more realistic!

Which set of code dates is correct?

My Super major engine that is being replaced is coded A 27 F and the replacement Thames Trader engine is dated a few days later being B 1 F.

I know there is some descrepancy between truck and tractor dates but to me it looks like the B 1 F engine was built on the first day after the camshaft and timing gear change, which is a pity as I was hoping that I had the earlier set up, due to the poor thrust surfaces of the later ones!

I have decided to fit my tractor front plate to the front of the Trader engine to make the set up look more un-tampered with, this is why I have been researching the camshafts as each of the three cam thrust set ups have a different front plate and it needs to match up.

Any help appreciated, Mike

Re: 590E engine date and Thames Trader compliance

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 10:34 pm
by DeereOllie
Mike,
I also have what I think is a 590E engine in a Super Major. I bought it with the engine in already, but most of the rest of the tractor simply wasn't there. I was told by the fitter who I bought it off, and who half did the conversion, the engine he took out of a Clayson combine. Since it seems you know about these things, I was wondering if you knew how I could date my engine, and what its good and bad points are. Here are all the casting codes and numbers i got off the engine.
Block casting number located under the injection pump; 508E 6015 DT3
Serial number on machined pad at front, right up next to the head mating S313783
Head casting number on pump side of the head 510E-6050-E A FL
Cheers
Ollie

Re: 590E engine date and Thames Trader compliance

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 11:00 pm
by DeereOllie
Just another thing, I've seen in here a picture somewhere of what looks like a standard 4 cylinder rod operated starter motor on a 590E engine. I'd love to keep the rod operated starter but is the starter man enough to throw the six over, and will the ring gear etc all match up if I go out a buy a new standard starter motor?
Ollie

Re: 590E engine date and Thames Trader compliance

PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 7:07 pm
by Pascal
Hi guys,

May be you have seen the topic "This and that about 590e" in this category?
There's quite some info you are looking for, I guess.
An original starter in good order will do. I have used a Dorset (electrical) starter.

Re: 590E engine date and Thames Trader compliance

PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 4:12 am
by Steven B
DeereOllie wrote:Just another thing, I've seen in here a picture somewhere of what looks like a standard 4 cylinder rod operated starter motor on a 590E engine. I'd love to keep the rod operated starter but is the starter man enough to throw the six over, and will the ring gear etc all match up if I go out a buy a new standard starter motor?
Ollie


Thames Trader trucks with 6 cylinder engines had the rod operated starter up until 1960. They then changed to the key type. The rod operated starter is the same as that on the tractor.

I have a truck with this starter in my yard, The lever comes up through the floor and you pull it up to operate. You should have no issues using this starter provided it is in good order.

Steve

Re: 590E engine date and Thames Trader compliance

PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:36 am
by 1962 model
DeereOllie wrote:Mike,
I also have what I think is a 590E engine in a Super Major. I bought it with the engine in already, but most of the rest of the tractor simply wasn't there. I was told by the fitter who I bought it off, and who half did the conversion, the engine he took out of a Clayson combine. Since it seems you know about these things, I was wondering if you knew how I could date my engine, and what its good and bad points are. Here are all the casting codes and numbers i got off the engine.
Block casting number located under the injection pump; 508E 6015 DT3
Serial number on machined pad at front, right up next to the head mating S313783
Head casting number on pump side of the head 510E-6050-E A FL
Cheers
Ollie


The DT 3 doesn't seem to conform with the format described in the 590E site they sometimes seem to have messed up the date order but buy by what you describe the 3 indicates 1963.
The FL head is 1962 - 5 if I am right you should also have the Mimtec injection pump, this has a different mounting position from the earlier Simms pumps. The fuel pump is different too. The Mimtec injection pumps share some of the parts with the 1965 K series and the D series trucks.

The D in your date could well stand for April, but I cant work out the T except that it could stand for the end days of the month ( leaving out some letters which did occurr at times )

I didn't look at the country you are from could it be that this is an American date order Month /Day /year?

Mike

Re: 590E engine date and Thames Trader compliance

PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:15 pm
by DeereOllie
Mike,
Cheers for that information. The engine came out of a Clayson combine. It has a Simms injection pump which did have the pump up/down type of lift pump on the side of the injection pump, as well as the twin Bosch fuel filters. I've now taken this lift pump off and replaced it with a more tractor style lever type. I will also replace these fuel filters with standard tractor types.
Cheers Ollie

Re: 590E engine date and Thames Trader compliance

PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:13 am
by 1962 model
Hello,
Ollie, mine had twin filters bolted to the engine and a Bosch lift pump as well and like you I have removed all this and made it the same as the tractor. I made a blanking plate for the side of the Injection pump from 6mm plate.

My project has slowed due to a protracted dispute with a neighbour, as well as weather considerations.

I have managed to get another Power Major so I could use the rear wheels for my early Super Major , these are 18.4 - 28 and the rims I will be fitting them to have been widened by 100mm ( 4" ) I was pleasantly surprised to find that these are 10 ply tyres, nice when something goes right!

Mike