Owning a rare tractor is great, apart from not being able to find information on it!
My needs are simple; all I want is some factory original illustrations of an electrically equipped Fordson N with a Leopard under the bonnet. The much-published one at a 1937 show in the UK is crank start.
The details I would like are: what the battery platform/box looked like and its location, starter switch and location, fuel tank extension bracket illustrations/dimensions, wiring diagram or general layout. I think there was an engine stop cable. Where did it go? Were the stub axle steering arms bent down to allow the tie rod to clear the sump or a special tie rod provided?
Would love to hear from you.
Eric
Perkins Leopard conversion
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Eric Schulz
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- Location: Victoria, Australia
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Eric Schulz
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- Posts: 60
- Joined: Fri Jun 13, 2008 4:17 am
- Location: Victoria, Australia
Kev, thanks for the welcome!
The avatar photo is our tractor, or nearly. Since that picture was taken the engine has been fitted to another tractor. Apart from now being two-toned, it looks about the same.
I admire your optimism about getting information. There are at least 2 Leopard conversions in NZ, neither complete with electrics, and I don't think there is an original one in the UK. But, you never know!
Eric
The avatar photo is our tractor, or nearly. Since that picture was taken the engine has been fitted to another tractor. Apart from now being two-toned, it looks about the same.
I admire your optimism about getting information. There are at least 2 Leopard conversions in NZ, neither complete with electrics, and I don't think there is an original one in the UK. But, you never know!
Eric
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David in Wales
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Hi Eric;
Long time since we last corresponded about Leopards. No one has found an original one here since I "discovered" them in the Tildesley archives in the early 1980's. But a few have been "manufactured" in recent years using engines from buses etc. None look exactly the same as the original though.
There is a new book out on the history of Perkins, havnt seen it yet to know if anything is in there on Leopards in Standards.
Could you email me please a few photos of yours.
David Bate dinas@arepo.com
Long time since we last corresponded about Leopards. No one has found an original one here since I "discovered" them in the Tildesley archives in the early 1980's. But a few have been "manufactured" in recent years using engines from buses etc. None look exactly the same as the original though.
There is a new book out on the history of Perkins, havnt seen it yet to know if anything is in there on Leopards in Standards.
Could you email me please a few photos of yours.
David Bate dinas@arepo.com
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Eric Schulz
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I must say I'm a bit disappointed, by now I thought I would have been overwhelmed with Leopard information!! 
When corresponding with the late Dereck Lambe, ex Perkins man, he said he went through the engine records and could identify 44 being made to Fordson specifications. 34 went to the Clyde Engineering Co, Wellington, New Zealand, for road graders, and 4 to Queens Bridge Motors, Melbourne, Australia.
It is some years ago that I was in touch with Dereck, but he said at the time all the drawings of these conversions would have still been available. They were not in the same place as he lived, so getting to see them was a problem which was never solved. If someone reading this has connections with Perkins, it would be good to check up on this.
This photo is scanned from the brochure. I couldn't believe it when looking through literature at a swap day to find a genuine original Perkins Leopard conversion brochure. Of interest is the chrome (?) badge under the radiator. Any of these in the UK?
Eric
When corresponding with the late Dereck Lambe, ex Perkins man, he said he went through the engine records and could identify 44 being made to Fordson specifications. 34 went to the Clyde Engineering Co, Wellington, New Zealand, for road graders, and 4 to Queens Bridge Motors, Melbourne, Australia.
It is some years ago that I was in touch with Dereck, but he said at the time all the drawings of these conversions would have still been available. They were not in the same place as he lived, so getting to see them was a problem which was never solved. If someone reading this has connections with Perkins, it would be good to check up on this.
This photo is scanned from the brochure. I couldn't believe it when looking through literature at a swap day to find a genuine original Perkins Leopard conversion brochure. Of interest is the chrome (?) badge under the radiator. Any of these in the UK?
Eric
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Aussie Frank
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Hi Eric,
I can not give any detailed information regarding your Leopard conversion, but I can give an observation. As little as possible will have been done to the standard electrics on the original tractor. Also given the very small number of conversions made, no standard wiring loom may have ever been made. Standard bus and car parts will have been used where ever possible. Electric start was never an option on a model N Fordson as far as my memory goes (please correct me if I am wrong), so wiring for that would have been done by a suitably qualified auto electrician on a case by case basis.
The questions I would ask myself when trying to work out this puzzle, would the standard model N battery carrier for lighting be large enough to carry a suitable battery to start a Leopard? If so it would not be changed. If not the later P6 conversion may be a good guide because it was carried over to the even later L4 convesion as well. As for the starter switch location, there would be no precedent for that, but it would be in a convenient location. Sit in the driver’s seat and you will find the likely location. Bear in mind the type of switch that it may have been. a low current switch operating a starter solenoid would most likely have been put into the dash panel for the lights, a high current switch may even have been a foot switch. As for the stop cable, the obvious spot is the hole that would be left by the ignition advance lever or alternatively a small panel like the one on a P6 if a larger battery carrier was needed.
Just my opinion, but if somebody comes to you and tells you that you have your electric start all wrong, take careful notes and admit that you added it later. The next time he comes it will be right, but I seriously doubt that that man will ever come in the first place.
Besides with such a rare tractor, it is allowed to have a working modification or two, just make sure that you use period parts and take it out for a good day's work after you fit the electric start and it will have earned the right to own your handiwork.
Just my two cents worth. I am green with envy.
Regards, Frank.
I can not give any detailed information regarding your Leopard conversion, but I can give an observation. As little as possible will have been done to the standard electrics on the original tractor. Also given the very small number of conversions made, no standard wiring loom may have ever been made. Standard bus and car parts will have been used where ever possible. Electric start was never an option on a model N Fordson as far as my memory goes (please correct me if I am wrong), so wiring for that would have been done by a suitably qualified auto electrician on a case by case basis.
The questions I would ask myself when trying to work out this puzzle, would the standard model N battery carrier for lighting be large enough to carry a suitable battery to start a Leopard? If so it would not be changed. If not the later P6 conversion may be a good guide because it was carried over to the even later L4 convesion as well. As for the starter switch location, there would be no precedent for that, but it would be in a convenient location. Sit in the driver’s seat and you will find the likely location. Bear in mind the type of switch that it may have been. a low current switch operating a starter solenoid would most likely have been put into the dash panel for the lights, a high current switch may even have been a foot switch. As for the stop cable, the obvious spot is the hole that would be left by the ignition advance lever or alternatively a small panel like the one on a P6 if a larger battery carrier was needed.
Just my opinion, but if somebody comes to you and tells you that you have your electric start all wrong, take careful notes and admit that you added it later. The next time he comes it will be right, but I seriously doubt that that man will ever come in the first place.
Besides with such a rare tractor, it is allowed to have a working modification or two, just make sure that you use period parts and take it out for a good day's work after you fit the electric start and it will have earned the right to own your handiwork.
Just my two cents worth. I am green with envy.
Regards, Frank.
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David in Wales
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Hi Eric;
This photo is from my book "A Fordson Dealer Portfolio" the history of Reginald Tildesley one of the largest Fordson/Ford dealers in England.
Tildeslay supplied the engine-less Fordson N tractors to Perkins for conversion to Leopard diesel engines. This photo was taken during the original tractor trials by Tildesley/Perkins in June 1937 just before the Royal Show.
Look at the driver Bert Brandon who looks similar facially to the guy driving on the original Perkins brochure. Bert was one of Tildesley's main salesmen, and he invented and constructed several machines whilst working there, and had several patents to his name.
David
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Eric Schulz
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Thanks Frank and David for your feedback.
Frank, what you say is all logical and reasonable, but doesn’t satisfy my curiosity! You said "Electric start was never an option on a model N Fordson as far as my memory goes (please correct me if I am wrong)". Yes and no. Ford never offered an electric start, but Perkins did on their engines. The only electrics offered by Ford was a lighting system. Very few ever being sold in Australia. Our Leopard has a factory fitted starter motor.
The accompanying photo shows a Leopard with Fordson attachments and a generator.
The Fordson conversion must have been a unique project for Perkins. They were in the business of making and selling engines, not making up machinery with their engines fitted. As David said, they bought the engineless tractors and fitted their own engines. The tractors were then offered with these options:
Regardless of numbers eventually built, a firm like Perkins would have had a set of drawings or blueprints for the project before starting. I also believe there would have been a designated place for every component. I just want to know where they were. Is that too much to ask? Yes, I know, but I am - as I said - curious.
It is fairly certain that on oil gauge was fitted. What brand was it, and where was it mounted. Yes, I asked a lot of questions when I was a kid too!
I thought I had posted a picture of our tractor before, but can’t see it.
Things to note: the oil filler cap was on the engine and comes from a Ford V8 (anyone got an original?), the fuel filter is non-standard and comes from a Ronaldson-Tippett diesel engine, though not very visible, the non-authentic fuel tank extension brackets. The wheels are typical Australian 24 and 16 inch.
Since that photo was taken the tractor has been removed and another one fitted. Still an orange model, and with original paint and the engine turned brown by diesel stains. It needs a tidy up and repaint. It’s owners need more energy!
Eric
Frank, what you say is all logical and reasonable, but doesn’t satisfy my curiosity! You said "Electric start was never an option on a model N Fordson as far as my memory goes (please correct me if I am wrong)". Yes and no. Ford never offered an electric start, but Perkins did on their engines. The only electrics offered by Ford was a lighting system. Very few ever being sold in Australia. Our Leopard has a factory fitted starter motor.
The accompanying photo shows a Leopard with Fordson attachments and a generator.
The Fordson conversion must have been a unique project for Perkins. They were in the business of making and selling engines, not making up machinery with their engines fitted. As David said, they bought the engineless tractors and fitted their own engines. The tractors were then offered with these options:
Regardless of numbers eventually built, a firm like Perkins would have had a set of drawings or blueprints for the project before starting. I also believe there would have been a designated place for every component. I just want to know where they were. Is that too much to ask? Yes, I know, but I am - as I said - curious.
It is fairly certain that on oil gauge was fitted. What brand was it, and where was it mounted. Yes, I asked a lot of questions when I was a kid too!
I thought I had posted a picture of our tractor before, but can’t see it.
Things to note: the oil filler cap was on the engine and comes from a Ford V8 (anyone got an original?), the fuel filter is non-standard and comes from a Ronaldson-Tippett diesel engine, though not very visible, the non-authentic fuel tank extension brackets. The wheels are typical Australian 24 and 16 inch.
Since that photo was taken the tractor has been removed and another one fitted. Still an orange model, and with original paint and the engine turned brown by diesel stains. It needs a tidy up and repaint. It’s owners need more energy!
Eric
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David in Wales
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Hi Eric;
With such a limited production run, any parts used would be been new "off the shelf" stuff easily and cheaply available. Tildesley used many Ford/Fordson parts from their spares dept for the modifications/specials that they constructed in limited numbers.
I would hazard a guess that as they made the prototype and supplied the engine-less tractors to Perkins, any extra spares would have come from their stores or been manufactured in their workshops and sent to Perkins for assembly.
Tildesley supplied 29 skid units to Perkins from February 1937 to March 1939 according to the Tildesley stock books which I have. The supplies were sporadic, based on demand/sales. My thoughts would be that due to the high price, tractors would be built as and when they were sold, rather than building for stock.
No one can say if those 29 were the only tractors built, maybe an other dealer won the contract to supply Perkins based on price during those 2 years of production.
A few new Leopard engined tractors are known to have been supplied to farms in England, one farm in Norfolk (East England) bought several. None are known to exist in England, though several reproductions have been built recently using engines from buses or industrail cranes etc. These engines are different to those in known tractor photos.
Its 69-71 years since they were built, no one alive today to fill us in with the details unfortunately.
David
With such a limited production run, any parts used would be been new "off the shelf" stuff easily and cheaply available. Tildesley used many Ford/Fordson parts from their spares dept for the modifications/specials that they constructed in limited numbers.
I would hazard a guess that as they made the prototype and supplied the engine-less tractors to Perkins, any extra spares would have come from their stores or been manufactured in their workshops and sent to Perkins for assembly.
Tildesley supplied 29 skid units to Perkins from February 1937 to March 1939 according to the Tildesley stock books which I have. The supplies were sporadic, based on demand/sales. My thoughts would be that due to the high price, tractors would be built as and when they were sold, rather than building for stock.
No one can say if those 29 were the only tractors built, maybe an other dealer won the contract to supply Perkins based on price during those 2 years of production.
A few new Leopard engined tractors are known to have been supplied to farms in England, one farm in Norfolk (East England) bought several. None are known to exist in England, though several reproductions have been built recently using engines from buses or industrail cranes etc. These engines are different to those in known tractor photos.
Its 69-71 years since they were built, no one alive today to fill us in with the details unfortunately.
David
Gentlemen,
Some model "N"s were offered with electric start. J.J.Wright had a Stanhay bomb hoist ex WD based on an "N", that had a massive air operated crane fitted. The compressor drove from the belt pulley and massive cylinder on the back. We used it for many years as the yard tractor loading and unloading lorries loaded with implements or stillages of parts from either Ford or Heatray-Sadia which were machined in our machine shop.
She was on solid rubber wheels and when at top speed in the yard on concrete it sounded like an approaching earthquake. She had electric start and the battery was mounted on the side opposite the belt pulley.
Some model "N"s were offered with electric start. J.J.Wright had a Stanhay bomb hoist ex WD based on an "N", that had a massive air operated crane fitted. The compressor drove from the belt pulley and massive cylinder on the back. We used it for many years as the yard tractor loading and unloading lorries loaded with implements or stillages of parts from either Ford or Heatray-Sadia which were machined in our machine shop.
She was on solid rubber wheels and when at top speed in the yard on concrete it sounded like an approaching earthquake. She had electric start and the battery was mounted on the side opposite the belt pulley.
Fordson Tractor Pages, now officially linked to: Fordson Tractor Club of Australia, Ford and Fordson Association and Blue Force.
Brian
Brian
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Aussie Frank
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Frank,
To be honest I never took any notice at the time, just clambered into the seat and pushed the button when i needed to. Sorry. I have seen one at a show though a few years ago.
To be honest I never took any notice at the time, just clambered into the seat and pushed the button when i needed to. Sorry. I have seen one at a show though a few years ago.
Fordson Tractor Pages, now officially linked to: Fordson Tractor Club of Australia, Ford and Fordson Association and Blue Force.
Brian
Brian
Perkins Leopard Conversion
Eric,
Without getting to involved in the Perkins Leopard discussion, the photos of the engine with Fordson fittings seems to have over-length clutch pegs.
Derek Lambe (who I didn't know had passed on) mentioned this to me on more than one occasion. He also had a Perkins Leopard in some old excavator (Rapier, I think) and the engine in it had started life in a Model N Fordson. He also had a couple of other very interesting Perkins.
I will see if I can dig out some of his old letters as he quoted a lot of numbers, including the engines that came to Queens Bridge Motors.
Without getting to involved in the Perkins Leopard discussion, the photos of the engine with Fordson fittings seems to have over-length clutch pegs.
Derek Lambe (who I didn't know had passed on) mentioned this to me on more than one occasion. He also had a Perkins Leopard in some old excavator (Rapier, I think) and the engine in it had started life in a Model N Fordson. He also had a couple of other very interesting Perkins.
I will see if I can dig out some of his old letters as he quoted a lot of numbers, including the engines that came to Queens Bridge Motors.
BarryM