New owner E27N starting problem

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Bluebilly
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Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 5:01 pm
Location: Waterfoot, Glasgow, Scotland

New owner E27N starting problem

Post by Bluebilly »

I have just got my first Fordson registered in 1948 which has lain idle for 10/15 years. It's fitted with an electric start, but it's not wired in properly yet, so I'm jumping it off a battery. The fuel tank was recently repaired and has clean petrol in it. I had to adjust the float (fitted by previous owner) as fuel was overflowing into the manifold. When it fired up, it ran on all 4 cylinders for about 20seconds, then stopped. It will fire again, but stops in the same timeframe.
The carb is a British made Ford, and so far I haven't seen the same one in any pictures on the net, and the information in the workshop manual is talking about a different model of carb, so setting it up properly might do the trick.
Info on the net indicates that it might be a magneto problem, but I don't want to go there until I've tried the simple stuff first
Any help will be great.
1948 E27N
1958 Dexta
1969 DB 880
TEF 20
MF135 multipower
MF 165
MF 240

tmc
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Posts: 58
Joined: Thu Nov 27, 2008 10:35 pm
Location: Devon, United Kingdom

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by tmc »

Hi , I think the problem is carb related , possibly not flowing enough fuel ( they do use quite a bit ! ) if the flow is to slow it would run then stop and once the carb refilled it would start again . There are only two commonly used carbs this link shows
a photo of the later one ( most common on E27N's )
http://www.fordsontractorpages.nl/phpbb ... f=1&t=1509
I don't remember if the carb is made by Ford , does yours look like the the photo ? But anyway check the flow through to the floatbowl.

Bluebilly
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Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 5:01 pm
Location: Waterfoot, Glasgow, Scotland

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by Bluebilly »

Thanks for your quick reply. I have the same carb that's shown in the photo. When I first filled the tank with petrol, the glass bowl took a while to fill up, and I did wonder at the time if it was a bit on the slow side, so, that's where I will look next. Any idea on how to set up the carb? How much is the main jet valve open? At the moment its about 1 1/2 turn open, and try as I might I can't find any info on the net.
1948 E27N
1958 Dexta
1969 DB 880
TEF 20
MF135 multipower
MF 165
MF 240

scoobyjim
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Posts: 173
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2013 5:38 pm

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by scoobyjim »

The glass bowl should fill up very quickly. There should be a filter in the tank. It may be blocked. Siunds like its drinking the petrol in the carb bowl and running out then filling back up slowly.

tmc
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Posts: 58
Joined: Thu Nov 27, 2008 10:35 pm
Location: Devon, United Kingdom

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by tmc »

With my carb I haven't found it fussy ,( unlike the earlier type carb on my standard N ) between 1 1/2 and 2 1/2 should run ok initially , then once it keeps going you can slowly adjust for best running , definitely sounds like the flow from the tank doesn't it ? You should be off for a drive this weekend !! Good luck !

Jerry Coles
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Location: Camerton, Bath, UK

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by Jerry Coles »

try disconnecting the fuel line from the tank at the carb (I'd recommend this only with a cold engine) and run it into a jar or can. Open the fuel tap note the flow, it should run out quite fast. If it doesn't then I would remove the tap and filter bowl assembly after draining the tank and clean out the bottom of the tank of any crud lurking in there. Had a friend with an old Austin which would stop for no apparent reason. Wait 5 min and off it would go no problem then stop again. Turned out to be a screwdriver that had been dropped in the tank and was covering the fuel outlet occasionally.
cheers
Jerry
Jerry Coles
Camerton, Bath, UK
West Highland White Terriers, Dexta's, E27N's and DUKW's

Bluebilly
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Posts: 52
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 5:01 pm
Location: Waterfoot, Glasgow, Scotland

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by Bluebilly »

Thanks to you all for the sound advice. The tank was repaired 10 years ago and has been empty ever since. Next weekend I'll follow all your advice and will be draining the tank and take the pipe off and sort the blockage - I'm sure that will sort it. :D
1948 E27N
1958 Dexta
1969 DB 880
TEF 20
MF135 multipower
MF 165
MF 240

Bluebilly
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Posts: 52
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 5:01 pm
Location: Waterfoot, Glasgow, Scotland

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by Bluebilly »

Yeee haaaa, got it running today!!! The problem turned out to be where the petrol fuel line goes into the sight bowl. The length from the end of the pipe to the olive was too long and was butting against the casing, causing a restricted flow. 30 seconds with a hacksaw and problem solved. We ran it up, and took it for a short spin and its all working fine after 'resting' for the last decade. Put some TVO in the tank and tried it on that too without problems.
Now it's running I can get all the electrics fitted and start looking at some tinwork repairs - anyone know what type of lights and starting switch is fitted? I have the dashboard, horn button,lights, ammeter, solenoid, dynamo and starter motor so can get cracking with that.
1948 E27N
1958 Dexta
1969 DB 880
TEF 20
MF135 multipower
MF 165
MF 240

Dandy Dave
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Posts: 1848
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2009 2:49 am
Location: Hudson, NY

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by Dandy Dave »

Nice! Glad to hear you are up and running. When all else fails, looks for something simple. :D Dandy Dave!
Have a Fordsonful day Folks!

1960 Fordson Power Major

super6954
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Posts: 781
Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2008 8:21 pm
Location: Manitoba,Canada

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by super6954 »

Bluebilly wrote:Yeee haaaa, got it running today!!! The problem turned out to be where the petrol fuel line goes into the sight bowl. The length from the end of the pipe to the olive was too long and was butting against the casing, causing a restricted flow. 30 seconds with a hacksaw and problem solved. We ran it up, and took it for a short spin and its all working fine after 'resting' for the last decade. Put some TVO in the tank and tried it on that too without problems.
Now it's running I can get all the electrics fitted and start looking at some tinwork repairs - anyone know what type of lights and starting switch is fitted? I have the dashboard, horn button,lights, ammeter, solenoid, dynamo and starter motor so can get cracking with that.
Hi
Glad you got it running :D , I 've been watching this for a while. On the lights I think some came with the engine electrics package and not the light one . The one I have in Canada was like that I believe from new :| .
I think one of the repro parts guys online has the start switch for the e27n petrol. the diesel p6 one is different. Mine still has the working original fitted, so Can't really help their sadly.
The lights and horn sadly are not reproduced for the E27N :cry: so are probably gonna cost you 400 plus, by the time you find them in good condition. Everybody wants them to finish their project :cry: , they come up on Ebay once in a while :wink: but make crazy money :eyes: . Brackets are reproduced seen them for less than 100 a set on Ebay sometimes, or in tractor magazines :)
Good luck on finding the parts, let us know how you do getting them :) .
Regards Robert
A Fordson is for life not just for Christmas !.

Bluebilly
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Posts: 52
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 5:01 pm
Location: Waterfoot, Glasgow, Scotland

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by Bluebilly »

Thanks Robert. Luckily, the previous owner had started fitting the lights and brackets, and both are original - including the lenses, so that saves me a few quid. I need to get to some rallies and see what others have fitted for the light switch. My priority is to get it starting off a switch,rather than using a battery and jump leads onto the starter motor - then I'll tinker with the rest to get it right. I bought this as a project, so I'm not rushing into anything - it runs, thats the important bit :-)
1948 E27N
1958 Dexta
1969 DB 880
TEF 20
MF135 multipower
MF 165
MF 240

super6954
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Posts: 781
Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2008 8:21 pm
Location: Manitoba,Canada

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by super6954 »

Hi
Yeah you got lucky with the lights :D . I want some for mine but not gonna pay more than the $700 I paid for the running tractor :eyes: :cry: :!: . if you want to know about the light switch mine is original, and the same style as the new major type, But doesn't have the key switch part in the middle of the light switch handle, like the new major ones. these are available as repros on line somewhere :wink:, but can't think who had them :( .
Regards Robert
A Fordson is for life not just for Christmas !.

Bluebilly
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Posts: 52
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 5:01 pm
Location: Waterfoot, Glasgow, Scotland

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by Bluebilly »

Thanks again Robert, I found one on line which will get me going :beer:
1948 E27N
1958 Dexta
1969 DB 880
TEF 20
MF135 multipower
MF 165
MF 240

Bluebilly
True Blue
Posts: 52
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 5:01 pm
Location: Waterfoot, Glasgow, Scotland

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by Bluebilly »

Well, that's all the wiring run in and it's all working apart from the ammeter - anyone know what might stop it working? It's a new one, bought recently and is wired as per the diagram. Its all parked up now waiting till I get home again in December to tidy up the cabling and attack some of the rusty bits.
I drained off all the oil from the engine, gearbox and rear axle - there was some horrible stuff coming out - it looked more like the oil we load to burn in large marine boilers ----gloop gloop.
1948 E27N
1958 Dexta
1969 DB 880
TEF 20
MF135 multipower
MF 165
MF 240

Dandy Dave
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Posts: 1848
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2009 2:49 am
Location: Hudson, NY

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by Dandy Dave »

Are you sure the regulator is working? Use a Multi Meter set on volts and see if you are getting 7.5 to 8 volts on a six volt system while the tractor is running. if not, the charging system is not working. Did you polarize the regulator? Dandy Dave!
Have a Fordsonful day Folks!

1960 Fordson Power Major

super6954
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Posts: 781
Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2008 8:21 pm
Location: Manitoba,Canada

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by super6954 »

Dandy Dave wrote:Are you sure the regulator is working? Use a Multi Meter set on volts and see if you are getting 7.5 to 8 volts on a six volt system while the tractor is running. if not, the charging system is not working. Did you polarize the regulator? Dandy Dave!
Hi Dave
The E27N is a 12 volt system :wink: So I would be thinking he needs between 13 low - 14.5 high side depending how the voltage regulator is set, if the thing is charging.
I guess he might need to rev the motor a bit to. I've seen some that don't kick in until a way past Idle,Like my 5000 super major, Then see what happens as well :idea: .
Regards Robert
A Fordson is for life not just for Christmas !.

Bluebilly
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Posts: 52
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 5:01 pm
Location: Waterfoot, Glasgow, Scotland

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by Bluebilly »

Thanks for the help guys, I'm working overseas now till December, so the project is on hold till then. Once I get home I'll check out the regulator.
1948 E27N
1958 Dexta
1969 DB 880
TEF 20
MF135 multipower
MF 165
MF 240

Dandy Dave
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Posts: 1848
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2009 2:49 am
Location: Hudson, NY

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by Dandy Dave »

super6954 wrote:
Dandy Dave wrote:Are you sure the regulator is working? Use a Multi Meter set on volts and see if you are getting 7.5 to 8 volts on a six volt system while the tractor is running. if not, the charging system is not working. Did you polarize the regulator? Dandy Dave!
Hi Dave
The E27N is a 12 volt system :wink: So I would be thinking he needs between 13 low - 14.5 high side depending how the voltage regulator is set, if the thing is charging.
I guess he might need to rev the motor a bit to. I've seen some that don't kick in until a way past Idle,Like my 5000 super major, Then see what happens as well :idea: .
Regards Robert
Note taken. We do not have any E27N's in my area. I just guestimated that it was old enough to be 6 volt. Yes you are correct on the voltage if it is a 12 volt system. Dandy Dave!
Have a Fordsonful day Folks!

1960 Fordson Power Major

super6954
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Posts: 781
Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2008 8:21 pm
Location: Manitoba,Canada

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by super6954 »

Hi Dave
I heard there aren't many E27N 's round in the states anyway. Is that true :?:
No problem on the 6 volt system info. I would still bet $100 you will have forgot more than I will ever know about a load of this old iron. :wink: :) .
Regards Robert
A Fordson is for life not just for Christmas !.

CalGG
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Posts: 83
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 2:44 am

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by CalGG »

I would say there are VERY FEW E27n's in the states.

Just ask anyone who has one ;-)

The ones here have come down from Canada to the best of my awareness. As you go south, the only E27n's you see are trailer queens.
I believe that business practices within the Ford family kept the Dagenham lovelies off the dance floor. The US had it's Ferguson's etc.

I would like to know what number of units were brought directly into the States, I've not been successful with that yet.

12V positive ground. At times the regulators can get hard to find inexpensively.
Converting to negative ground is just as easy as mounting the reg and flashing the gen. Oh, the Amp meter reads right to left if you do ;-)

Dandy Dave
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Posts: 1848
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2009 2:49 am
Location: Hudson, NY

Re: New owner E27N starting problem

Post by Dandy Dave »

Yes. Very true that there are very few E27N's over here. There are none in my area that I know of, and NY state borders Canada. When you have worked on enough odd stuff it is not that difficult to trouble shoot one that you have not worked on before. These old machines all run on the same basic princples. Keep that in mind and you can fix pretty much anything if you have any mechanical abilities at all. Dandy Dave!
Have a Fordsonful day Folks!

1960 Fordson Power Major

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