Timing cover AND other questions. 1952 Gas Major

[52GasMajor]

Here are some photos of the intake screen, cover, and a couple shots up inside the sump (best I could get) showing some of the bottom end.

https://www.amazon.ca/photos/share/OyHa ... fn6V79UoGB

The motor looks REALLY clean to me... A few small chunks on the intake screen, I think it was gasket maker material. That's what the cover was sealed to the sump with. It now has a (home-made) paper gasket. The top end looks just as clean from everything I can see.

It has the Ford/Fram (not AC) oil filter housing. I have a new filter and new gaskets for this as well.

At this point I am almost certain it has been run on detergent oil, no?

Can you tell me the measurements for the wide belt, if they are available, please? I would like to see if there are any equivalent belts (might be able to find something 7/8ths wide), otherwise I will likely have to get one shipped to Canada from the UK. I recall you said 13/16ths for the width, do you know the length?

Oh, also, I figured out why it has the "skinny" belt. The alternator has the "skinny" pulley and they didn't bother to change it. Luckily my local tractor shop has the correct wide pulley for it and I plan to get that at the same time.

Thanks!

[Billy26F5]

I would agree it looks clean. A bit surprised the sump hasn't got red oxide on it but maybe it was cleaned very aggressively. The belt length is 42.9".
Sandy

[52GasMajor]

Thank you for that belt measurement!

I pulled the cross-shaft between the governor and the carburetor today.

What a good suggestion!

The buildup was like thick like clay, very sticky, and full of grit.

https://www.amazon.ca/photos/share/MaOk ... PQ14vvdpGN

Shaft, block hole, and all connecting points between the carb will be cleaned and oiled before reassembly.

What's the easiest way to clean the hole through the block without a long bristled wire brush?

A little carb cleaner and compressed air, a little gas or diesel and air, coat hanger/wire and air...?

Thanks again!

[Billy26F5]

Not great. Blowing through with petrol or paraffin is best. Then a squirt of engine oil in.
Sandy

[52GasMajor]

Ok, so I'm about to test the compression...

I let the motor heat up to about 170° for the first time since owning it. I do not know if the thermostat opened, or even exists. The rad and hoses will be removed soon, so I will check the thermostat while I'm there.

Oil pressure started around ~40PSI @ idle and was holding at around 18psi at 170° according to the gauges.

Noticed a substantial amount of oil coming from the front of the motor somewhere. I believe it's the front crankshaft seal, if so it's REALLY BAD. I think it may be so deteriorated that it's basically not there with the amount of oil it puked out.

That will be the next job on the list I suppose.

I can see the two support rods to the "firewall", but where else is the nose cone attached?

Also is there supposed to be a breather on the timing cover? If so, where? The loader arms and radiator make it hard to see what is going on. 🫤

Thanks!

[52GasMajor]

Here's the cylinder results.

#1 was a surprise, I would have thought #2 would have been the lowest. 🫤

Code: Select all

 Front of Motor  1-86PSI |  2-90PSI |  3-95PSI |  4-92PSI Rear of Motor 

Cylinder hone and new rings at some point in the future?

[52GasMajor]

Actually those cylinder pressure results are likely off... I forgot that the throttle was at idle and not wide open.

Test will be redone in the future, but should still give a rough idea of the condition.

[Billy26F5]

If it reached 170ºF it does have a working thermostat (they normally fail open). Not great about the leak. The only breathing here is the connection between the rocker cover and intake manifold, timing cover breathers came in with the Mk2.Compression doesn't sound too great (but good that all have similar numbers, it's never good when one is very different), but leaving the throttle closed doesn't help that at all. Rings are not available new, you'll have to find someone who makes rings to help, as your bore is 95mm, not the 100 mm of diesel and TVO engines.
Sandy

[52GasMajor]

I would need the ring measurements for both compression and oil to see if there are any others that can be matched up.

I'll have to redo the compression test, clearly, but it will have to wait until I deal with the front cover issues.

What was the designed compression? 130, 160, or?

The carb says it's a Zenith AXA 36. I CANNOT find anything about this carb, other than one other person on here looking for the same answers I am...

What rebuild kit works with this carb? Is it a Zenith 36 IV?

[John b]

Give these a try, pretty sure they ship worldwide
https://zenithcarb.co.uk/

[52GasMajor]

Thanks John!

Sent them an email, hoping they can shed some light on this carb.

[John b]

Hopefully they will be able to sort it for you

[52GasMajor]

Oh, it turns out the bad bearing I'm hearing is actually in the PTO box, not the throw-out/release bearing on the clutch. I didn't realize that I left the PTO engaged after replacing PTO lever seals. Once it was disengaged the very concerning noise went away.

Another job for the near future. I need to do the seal between trans and diff anyway...

[52GasMajor]

Alright,

The nose cone, rad, fan, alternator (new pulley done today), and front hydraulic drive components are disassembled...

Pictures https://www.amazon.ca/photos/share/G34t ... bf3jPILvdT

A few things I need answered:

1) Is that the correct crank pulley for a 1952 Fordson Major Gasoline?

I am guessing that they drilled and tapped two extra holes for the front hydraulic drive.

2) If you look closely at the engines, main, front cover you can see one spot on each side of the plate (one under the cover and one under the alternator bracket) that have ALSO been welded!

PLEASE tell me that someone added locating pins in those spots, and that those are not BROKEN BOLTS that they welded the cover to!!!

3) The belt that was on it was 45" and seemed to be the "correct" size (meaning not too much adjustment left in either direction)...so what's up with that!? Replacement belt (for now) is 44".

4) Best way to remove the 1 7/8" bolt (looks like a big bolt, not a nut as there are no visible threads or separation?) on the pulley?

I have the tractor in 5-6 H and the brakes locked on (the brakes work decently) and it still wants to turn the wheels, not the bolt...

Thanks!

[Billy26F5]

There's no spec on compression, the ratio is 5.5 to 1, and given that diesel usually needs 300 psi minimum and the diesel has 16 to 1, about 100 psi is a bare minimum. These are general minimums, and not official, so not a clear cut line. Ford never did compression tests, they generally preferred to measure parts directly. All three engines had the same pulley, it was the pointers that were different. I would agree with the extra holes being modified, as you can see a cast part number for the pulley hub. The new holes are those in line with the rivets. Looks like the plate has been modified with homemade dowels, the early plates didn't have dowels, and particularly with loaders they would move and leak. dowels and an extra bolt were added in 53. Your plate appears to be a later one, for it has the hole for the extra bolt, but only one dowel appears to be close to the correct location. Your dowels also look like they're 1/4", the original ones are 1/2" in the block and plate, only 1/4" for the timing cover. The belt adjustment should start as close to the engine as possible, that will give the longest belt life. Correct size belts are quite tight to fit. There was a spanner for it (TTr/D 6319, later CT.6) but any 1 13/16" socket will do fine. push the brakes on harder to loosen it, you might need to adjust them. Originally the bolt had rachets for the starting handle which yours would have come with.
Sandy

[52GasMajor]

Well this just became a MUCH bigger job.

So much for removing the pulley without removing the tombstone.

FML

https://www.amazon.ca/photos/share/X8Ni ... QwXda61sxy

[Billy26F5]

I'm afraid I failed to remember two changes that do allow a later pulley to come off without removing the casting: The later pulley is smaller (7.52" rather than 8.8") and the later front casting has a recess to enable it to come fully off. You can see one of the dowels in that pic of Billy.

Sorry about that and I'm afraid you now have a big job to get it off. I see a groove on the pulley hub, so that will need sorting.
Sandy

[52GasMajor]

Well it's off. Prepare yourself for this photo...

https://www.amazon.ca/photos/share/FtYb ... 6toeLVmr0y

What a piss off.

[Billy26F5]

Not a great position to be in. You'll now have to find new channels, the earliest ones didn't have the holes for the vacuum tank for industrial trailer brakes. You'll need to find out if yours had them or not. These holes are on both sides, roughly in line with the no. 4 cylinder. Some folk have made some for 6 cylinder conversions, it won't be stamped EnFo but it's also an option. Crank looks rather dirty, but should clean up easily. Front casting is 28 May 52.
Sandy

[52GasMajor]

Yes there will have to be a trip to the scrappy, as I already mentioned.

For now it will either get drilled, plates, and (grade 8?) bolts, or it will end up being welded back together as a temporary fix until the trip to the scrap yard can be arranged.

Likely in the coming spring/summer unfortunately.

One good bit of news is the gears look good, as well as the nuts/bolts securing them. I was fairly certain they would have seen attention when the motor was worked on last.

I do have one broken cover bolt (top right) that I'll have to deal with.

https://www.amazon.ca/photos/share/xJ2p ... UY9rVhh1mG

[Billy26F5]

I agree everything looks good. The cover wants a good clean before you fit the new seal, the gears and plate could do with one too but it's more difficult as it's possible for the petrol or paraffin you use for cleaning gets into the sump which you don't want. Just before final assembly give everything a coating of engine oil with an oil can, it's always worth doing. All the channel bolts are 1/2" UNC about 1" long. The channels are about 5/16" thick if you're interested in making new ones. The timing cover bolts are of three sizes, one lot are 5/16" UNF (3/4" long, the ones that bolt into the plate), the rest are 5/16" UNC, all but one 1 1/8" long, the one is 2 3/8" long, it's the one with the dynamo adjuster, all these other ones bolt into the block through cover and plate.
Sandy

[52GasMajor]

Dynamo adjuster got moved to top right water pump bolt to work with Delco-Remy 10si alternator.

Got the frame welded back together for now. Moved the tombstone ~3/8" further from the motor. Pulley just clears now, less that 1/16" clearance to get it in/out.

Timing cover and main cover got cleaned up.

Timing cover is reassembled, pulley back on (didn't seat the seal all the way in the cover so it hopefully won't ride in the groove - suggested by tractor mechanic), alternator back on, belt on.

If the pulley still leaks after this then I'll have it in for machining.

Still have to put the fan and rad back on, add coolant, and test run it before I put it totally back together.

3:45am now. I'll button the rest up tomorrow.

[Billy26F5]

Leaving the seal not fully seated is a common trick, but it doesn't tend to last well, for the seal isn't designed for such use and there are many pulleys (not your case) that have pitting which will wear away the seal in no time. Watch your front axle, it might well not take the relocation.
Sandy

[52GasMajor]

I cleaned the pulley, with 1200 grit, where the seal makes contact. Hoping it will last at least until spring.

What exactly do you mean by the axle not taking the relocation? It seems like there is enough "play" where it mounts in the front and rear pins/mounts...

I have a couple braces to weld in still but it should be fairly sturdy for what I need it for.

Oh and the 44" belt is too small, so back to the old 45" until I swap it out...

[Billy26F5]

That play is common but it shouldn't be there. The belt when new can somtimes require the dynamo to be removed from its front mounting to fit, but once over all three pulleys there will be plenty of space for it. It'll strech initially very quickly.
Sandy