E1ADKN manifold reassembly

[Tractorbob3]

When I dismantled the manifold assembly, there were some metal plates between the mainfold and the head (half a manifold each) that appeared to be placed against the head (they look like metal versions of the repalcement gaskets I have - they're like thick shims). The Workshop manual talks of putting the metal FACE of the gasket against the manifold but the pictures and text don't mention separate plates and where they should go - and there's little remaining of the original gaskets to give any clue. Any ideas anyone, please?

[Brian]

The E1ADKN manifold gasket is a metal sandwich.

They originally were thick sheets of copper but the later ones have the material banded by steel shim-like plates.

[Tractorbob3]

Thanks, Brian - is there anything you don't know about Fordsons? I have a replacement (2-part) gasket from Cox & Turner that is supposed to be for an E1ADKN - each part is half the length of the manifold. It is about one-tenth of an inch thick and has fibre faces with what looks like a thin foil centre. It has no metal faces, which is why I was a bit confused by the text in the manual.

I guess the solution is to put the gasket against the cylinder head , then the metal plates (they too are half a manifold long and also about one-tenth of an inch thick), then the manifold itself, metal-to-metal, but that doesn't seem right somehow - there will be no flexibility in the plate, so I would have thought leakage would be bound to happen? I'm just wondering now, having thought about your reply, if I should have ordered two (sets) of the gaskets so that I can sandwich the metal plates between them? Or maybe I should just leave them out and rely upon the fibre-faced gasket alone?

Sorry to be a pain .... but none of the stuff I have read seems to match what I'm looking at.

[Brian]

Picture of a genuine gasket for the Major. One side metal the other fibre. Fibre side goes to block.

[Tractorbob3]

You're a star! - thanks Brian. Looks like I need a conversation with Cox and Turner!

[BarryM]

Tractorbob 3,

The Plates you refer to are Copper, and if using these, you do not use a gasket as it defeats the purpose.

Following is an extract from the original Fordson Service Letters.

MANIFOLD-inlet and exhaust gasket.
It may be found, under certain working conditions, that although the inlet and exhaust manifold retains a high working temperature the engine coolant remains comparatively cold, and it is difficult to maintain a coolant working temperature of 180 degreesF, even with the radiator shutters closed.

By replacing the original manifold to block gaskets with gaskets cut from 16 gauge copper strip a much better transfer of heat from the manifold to the block will be gained.

Where running on of the engine or loss of engine power are observed the above fix will give some relief.

[Brian]

Barry,

I had copper ones on Henrietta originally and, like a fool, changed them when I was suffering air leaks on the intake side.

I managed to get some original old stock gaskets that came in a Fordson packet, from one of my contacts. These have a steel plate one side and a fibre side rivetted to it. That was one of these that I photographed so at some time, the copper ones were replaced.

The friend I got these from runs a spares shop devoted to the old Ford tractors and he was an ex Fordson stores man. He cannot remember the solid copper gaskets like I had fitted originally, being offered as spare parts.

Wish I had not thrown them away now but that was nearly 30 years ago.

[Tractorbob3]

Hmmnnnnn .... vairy interestink! The plates I have are certainly not copper - they look like aluminium, but feel a bit heavier - maybe an alloy of some kind? No sign of rust or other corrosion, or any heat effects that I can see. They appear to be solid - that is, they do not look as though they would compress like a copper gasket (although the service notice extract suggests the use of simple copper strip, which would not compress anyway). They were fitted in the order of ... head - plate - gasket - manifold. Maybe someone cut and fitted these as a substitute for the copper conversion - but then why use a fibre gasket as well? I should mention the tractor spent its early years at the National Agricultural Engineering Institute at Silsoe, so anything is possible!

Given that the face of the manifold has some erosion (not to mention a couple of cracks), I would not be happy butting the plate up to the manifold with something so inflexible - I can't see how a seal could be obtained.

Plan A, then, is to put everything back together as I found it (that is, with the plates against the head), but using a new gasket. I'm still waiting for a response from Cox & Turner to establish why the gasket they supplied does not have a metallic face. Someone has suggested I smear the face of the gasket with exhaust assembly compound as this will help to seal the cracks a bit and maybe prolong the life of the manifold while I sort out a more permanent solution.

Happy to consider any 'Plan Bs' you guys can come up with ...

[Tractorbob3]

Whoa! - Stop! - Mystery solved (I think)! Cleaned up the plates this evening and removed what was left of the gasket material and in the process found a couple of rivets. Seems like what I have are the type of gasket you have on yours, Brian, and what I need to do is take the C&T-supplied gaskets and rivet them to the plates, to make them complete. If these should be fitted plate-to-manifold, gasket-to-head, I think I may still use a bit of exhaust paste on the plate-to-manifold face, as the manifold is a bit pitted in places and this may help to seal the cracks also, as a temporary measure. Alternatively, I may drill a small hole at the ends of the cracks and channel out the crack line a little, then fill it with Thermosteel to hold things until I can fix it properly.

Thanks for all the thoughts and suggestions folks (and especially Brian) - this is still the best source of Fordson advice and information on the net.

[BarryM]

Hi All,

Some more information on the Manifold Gaskets. This is taken from the 'Export Service Letters 1955'.

"On current production Diesel and Petrol Tractor engines, the Inlet and Exhaust Manifold Gaskets are no longer fitted, as this jointing is now sealed with a special compound that is insoluble in gasoline, kerosene, diesel and lubricating oils, is entirely unaffected by water and will not flake, powder, harden or dissolve when correctly applied. This compound is available under Part No. EM4G-14.

The steel backed Inlet and Exhaust Gaskets (E1ADKN9448B & E1ADKN9441) will continue to be used in production and service for the Kerosene engine"