The Fordson Tractor Pages Forum

all new to me just started to take off cylinder head to see if head gasket is blown and check liners, 1953 major.water on top of pistons and oil blowing out of oil breather

Sounds like it. Also, look careful for cracks in the head. Do not turn it over with coolant in the cylinders. You could bend a rod. Is there antifreeze in the radiator? Dandy Dave!

All classic symptoms of a head gasket failure and/or a warped head -- although usually water is confined to the area of gasket failure and not all 4 cylinders. Would be interesting to know if all the head bolts appeared to have the correct tension when you removed them. Suggest you check the head for trueness and, whilst at it, give the valves and seats a re-grind. With water in the cylinders, the oil and filter will also need re-newing.
Pavel

drained water hope to take head off at the weekend,she had not been started for 12 years, thanks for any help

Check cylinder sleeves for correct protrusion.The sleeves being to low in the block has often been the cause of a blown head gasket on Fordsons and other wet
sleeve engines.

Hi
The other thing to do is check that the bolt holes in the block don't have rust and carbon in the bottoms, Have seen them where the bolts tighten down with torque wrench , But the heads not tight as the crud stops the bolt going in all the way . clean all the block treads with a 1/2" course imperial/ standard NC as called in north america tap, and wire brush or use the same size die on the bolts to clean treads also .

Not sure if you have done this already if not you need to remove the injectors first before taking the head off, the nozzles poke through the head face and if the head slides or is put down wrong, the ends can be knocked off or damaged. You really don't need that headache , with your other problem
Regards Robert

taken head off ,liners ok,no thermostat,exhaust holes nearly blocked solid,valves seem in good condition got to give a good clean now

With the holes blocked, It must be an oil burner. How much ridge on the cylinder tops??? Dandy Dave!

cleaned head off ,fitted new head gasket replaced head filled with water,then i noticed water seeping around the head gasket any ideas

Just some questions.
Did you clean the threaded holes and bolts?
Did you replace the O-ring in the middle of the head?
Did you use the right torque?
Did you start from the middle bolts to the outside ones in a few rounds?

did everthing you question but the o ring ,did not know there was one ,where in the head is it

Being you need to take it off again, you should also check the surfaces for flatness with a straight edge also if you have not already done so. Also look to see if the sleeves are above the block surface about .003 thousands of an inch. Dandy Dave!

The small 'O' ring mentioned is fitted at about the centre/middle of the head. There will be a hole in the head gasket for it to fit into. It provides the seal for the oil supply to the valves and rockers. This being the case,it has no bearing on your water leak.
As suggested twice now -- check the trueness of the cylinder head surface using a steel ruler and feeler gauge. You should not be able to insert a .001" feeler between them.
It also crosses my mind that you may, just may, have fitted the wrong head gasket or the incorrect gasket was fitted before. According to the Fordson manual there were 4 types fitted: a crimped steel one; a copper/asbestos one; plus 2 composition types -- 0.0236" or 0.039" thick. And the good book does suggest that an incorrect thin gasket will not properly seal.
Before ripping the head off again, try inserting a thin feeler blade between the head and block.
Lastly; if you access 'ebookbrowse' on the internet and type in Fordson Major Supplement you should be able to download the official Fordson Major engine overhaul manual which gives details upto, and including, the Super Major.
Pavel

copper head gasket on order will cure my promblems hopefully

had head skimmed, valves reseated

refitted head and gasket ran for 20 minutes,smoked alot and oil still blowing out of oil breather plus water in oil.engine is1962 super major in a 1953 tractor.took head back off water under gasket and head really blacked .any ideas, used compsit gasket

Check block for warpage and recheck sleeve protrusion.
Sleeve protrusion .002"-.004" Where sleeves have not been disturbed .001" and above is acceptable.
Clamp sleeves down using 4 bolts & washers to obtain a correct measurement.

The smoke and the oil coming from the breather are probably from worn or stuck rings and worn sleeves, like Dandy Dave mentioned.
The water that's still getting in the oil could be coming from several places.
Did you check the sleeve protrusion?
Did you have the head checked for cracks?
Did you look for cracks in the block between the sleeves?
You could have problems with the sleeves too, but be sure everything's OK on the top end while you're there.

going to check block today,liners take out pistons as well.only other thing that worries me is the engine being 1962 and the head being with rocker cover with 2 bolt holes ,is that the earler model and does it make any difference cheers for all help so far Paul

When i got my major, it had water in the oil, which turned out to be pitted liners, which i believe is caused by using the wrong anti-freeze. When i took the liners out, all the way around them there were tiny holes, which allowed water into the cylinders. As for blowing oil out the breather, like has been mentioned, it could be stuck rings causing excess back pressure, but you will see this when you remove the pistons.

Did you have the head crack tested when it was skimmed?

Nick wrote:When i got my major, it had water in the oil, which turned out to be pitted liners, which i believe is caused by using the wrong anti-freeze. When i took the liners out, all the way around them there were tiny holes, which allowed water into the cylinders. As for blowing oil out the breather, like has been mentioned, it could be stuck rings causing excess back pressure, but you will see this when you remove the pistons.

Did you have the head crack tested when it was skimmed?

hi Nick,got one piston out so far,rings seem ok,shells slightly scored,having trouble getting out lining no succsess yet,oil pick up pipe in the sump the gauzed filter must have fell off at sometime because it was in the bottom of sump,do not know that the cause of oil comig out of oil breather cheers for any help Paul

You will need to take all 4 pistons out, because even if two pistons are ok, and two have a couple stuck rings it will still cause alot of blowback. Ive pulled the liners out of two major engine now, both times i borrowed a liner puller for a cat diesel engine which is meant for 8" bores and it just fitted! You can buy pullers, but i think people tend to make them as usually you only need to use the tool once. I found that once the liner moved about 10mm you could almost pull them out with your hands.

The other place the oil could be getting in, is where the liners seal to the block with rubber o-rings. It sounds like your engine should have the double o-ring liner, whereas earlier engines have single o-rings. The only way I reckon your going to solve this as long as you know the head is ok, is to take all pistons out and look for damage, and then take the liners out.

How bad is the scoring on the crank? Measure the journals with a micrometer because that could need a re-grind.

after some investicating i have 1962 engine ,1952 sump and head i get high oil pressure on start up for a while then drops down really low. changed big end shells ,cleaned oil pump but no relief valve is that the promblem cheers paul

1952 engine has the oil pressure relief valve in the timing cover
1962 engine has the oil pressure relief valve as part of the oil pump.
If your 1962 engine has the 1952 sump(no doubt for the axle 'a' frame pin), then it will also have the 1952 oil pump fitted, as the 1962 oil pump will not fit in a 1952 sump.
Therefore your engine will have no oil pressure relief valve.
You don't say how high your oil pressure is on start-up, and then when running.

I have had a 1966 engine with a 1957 sump on one of my Majors, and the oil pressure was around 160psi. That in itself would probably not be good for the bearings.

Sounds like your engine is totally stripped down now, so might as well go the whole way and do it properly.

Not sure myself, but is the 1952 head compatiable with the later model engines Some of the other regular guys will know

You also say that you don't know why oil is coming out of the breather? Which breather do you mean? The oil fill hole on the rocker cover, the tube on the pushrod cover behind the injecter pump, the dipstick or the breather on the timing cover.

Kiwi Kev

engine is back together now,no oil coming out of oil breather now