more questions sup engine rebuild

[1su9pm6aj4]

Hello Fordson aficionados,

Have a few questions if you would be so kind. I installed the rear engine oil seal (split rope) with some difficulty this last Sunday on my engine rebuild. I had to loosen the crank cap bolts and drop the crank a bit to allow the real seal holder bolt holes to line up and screw in. When re tightening cap screws, besides sealant being forced out of the end of the holder where it meats the seal, it seems the rope on both ends has disappeared into the holder so I have no .015 " of extra rope to meet up with the oil pan side when I get to it. The 2 rope haves before installation seemed the same size as I placed them next to each other. I used blue silicone sealant, is that tough enough to fill the void and not leak? I did do a search here and couldn't find anything. .
I also found a crack in the gear (under timing cover) that turns the injection pump. the crack radiates out from the keyway for about 3/4 of an inch. A welder in town had me grind the crack open and he is going to fill it for me. Will it hold up if he is a good welder? Should I try to find a new gear? where? I also bought a new cam and gear cause the previous owner tried pull starting this tractor before I bought it. He did not know the engine was seized. he kind of messed up the gears a bit.
I also noticed when I took this engine apart, the inside of the front timing cover had a circle of lost aluminum where the idler gear was bumping against it. So the cam and cam gear must be moving back and forth a bit too much. Anyone seen that one before and have a fix for it.?
last question. When I attached the front plate, the book shows 5 large 2 hole connecting stop tabs for the larger bolts and one small one. I could only find 4, and I was pretty good at saving and bagging everything with notations when dismantling the engine. I put thread lock on the 2 bolts that did not have the holder tab. is that O K? Can I put lock washers on any other non tab bolts inside the timing cover or is there a clearance problem? I in fact put threat lock on all the inside bolts already, is that O K ? Have not put the timing cover on as yet as I am waiting for the injector pump gear to get welded.
Kind of long here so sorry about that.Thanks in advance for your help guys. kerry

[Brian]

If the seal does not protrude it will leak, the silicon sealer will not seal onto the moving crankshaft.

I would not weld the timing gear, it is fairly easy to get hold of a good second hand gear from a breaker. The reason for the wear on the timing cover is because you have a lot of camshaft end float. There were shims to go behind the horseshoe thrust washer if that was not taking up the movement.

Thread lock will be fine on the front plate bolts, the only time these gave any trouble was when a front loader was fitted and used hard. This put a lot of stress on the front plate.

[1su9pm6aj4]

Thanks Brian,

I will try and track down another injection pump gear. As for the cam travel..my engine never came with a cam thrust washer, it used the front plate as a washer. Since the front plate seems to allow too much travel, do you think I could use a suitable washer to take up some of the space behind the front plate?
Any thoughts on why my rope seal did not fill the void and protrude ? it is from Agriline and I don't want to order another if it is the same dimension. Do you or anyone have another source for the rope seal?

Thanks again for the help!
Kerry

[Brian]

Do you have a three bolt fixing cam shaft or a single bolt fixing one? What year is your tractor?

[1su9pm6aj4]

It's a single bolt that attaches the camshaft...1964 major. Thanks. Kerry

[Brian]

OK so you have a 1964 New Performance Super Major with a single bolt fixing cam shaft. With that engine you should have gears that are 23.75 mm to 23.88 mm wide on the inner gear and 23.57 mm to 23.75 mm wide on the outer gear. Your pump drive gear should be 23.5 mm to 23.62 mm wide.

Your cam shaft end float should be .005" to .021" (0.127 to 0.533 mm) and this is controlled by a special hardened area on the front mounting plate itself. The only way to change the end float is to replace the front mounting plate or the camshaft. The end float is controlled by the inner camshaft gear butting up against the cam shaft hub and the end float measured between the gear and the front plate. For your gear to touch the timing gear cover either the back of the front plate must be worn or the flange on the camshaft worn allowing the whole lot to move forward. The helical cut of the gears will exacerbate this.

Other than that, were the gears loose?

[1su9pm6aj4]

Hi Brian,

The camshaft is new, the old one was severely damaged (a couple lobes were half their original height) causing me to think the flange you mentioned could have been worn enough to allow at least some of the movement we are talking about. Hard for me to say if the front plate was worn in that area, it didn't look like it. it had some shallow groove marks, that's about it. Guess I could get the cam retainer area of the plate built up with welding and then have it machined down for a fix if it really is worn, wouldn't the worn surface be the softer of the two metals? . As far as looseness with the gears meshing I cannot say if they were, I took the tractor apart without checking.
Hey any advise with the rear engine seal? I will pull the one I just installed and try and figure out why it is not long enough, (maybe they sent me a rope seal for a smaller diameter Crank) or if it was too compressed or something. I at least have the other half of the rope seal to try again. I did see quite a bit of extra length on the old rope seal when I removed it. As a side note, the new oil pump from Agriline has 2 mounting holes that don't quite line up. I will have to open up one of the holes a bit, not wanting to do that though as the edge of the pump and the hole won't have much metal between them. Well, all for now and thanks again

Kerry

[Brian]

The new camshaft will most likely sort your problem or at least get it into the right free play area. I would not get it built up unless it is way out. Your tractor was notorious for eating cam shafts Nearly every engine of that model we took down had to have a new camshaft and tappets.

I do not really have an answer for the seal other than try your Case New Holland dealer. As you have found from your oil pump, most new parts are supplied by the "Land of Nearly Right" across the Irish Sea and are of poor Quality in build, specification and material. Sparex are some of the best but even they have their problems, I had to fit 5 Sparex condensers to get one good one when I did Dotty's engine earlier in the year.

[BearCreek Majors]

Hi Kerry, your oil seal is most likely the wrong one, I had the same issue with the same vendor, they eventually sent me a new/correct one. They sell a lot of good parts at a good price, but quality and customer satisfaction does not seem to be the company motto.

Pat

[1su9pm6aj4]

Thanks for the reply,

O K then Brian, I will continue with installing the gears and then timing cover. Any thoughts on why my model tractor ate up camshafts? I would like to try and correct the problem at this point if possible.

On the oil seal, I will email Agriline and see if they will send me a new one. The current one came in an engine kit. They have been good with me so far on fixing any mistakes. I will check in with new holland also. Sorry about the condenser problem with Sparex. 5 times is 5 times too many plus 10 times frustration. Did you have to get counsilng to avoid a breakdown? When the machinist had my engine block and was installing the piston liners, we tried 3 times to finally get the correct size liner seals from the "Land of almost right". I wonder if the spindle dimensions have been corrected by now, I read an older thread about problems with fitment with those .

Anyway thanks again, cannot say it enough, the manuel is one thing, but people with experience is what gets the tractor together and running well. See you!

[Brian]

They changed the valve springs and also the manufacture of the camshaft. There is no cure as far as I know but remember, your tractor is nearly 50 years old, your new parts will possibly see you out!

[1su9pm6aj4]

I bought the cam from a place in Texas, maybe it is stronger, but either way the engine should last for my uses. Hey you know anyone that has turboed this engine? Doesn't seem like too big of a deal, just thinking out loud. Thanks. Kerry

[Brian]

The engine was getting pretty close to its design limits at 55hp, a turbo would perhaps be a bit too much but who knows. What I have seen many years ago in Holland, was the standard back end and gearbox fitted with a Rolls-Royce Merlin engine and rated at 1300 hp.

[Mjg1705]

I bought the cam from a place in Texas, maybe it is stronger, but either way the engine should last for my uses. Hey you know anyone that has turboed this engine? Doesn't seem like too big of a deal, just thinking out loud. Thanks. Kerry

Hi best advice - don't turbo it - I've seen it attempted - and unless you like the look of con-rods coming out of the block - its not a wise idea - - although I have thought about it but I think it's safe if us major people just put turbos on the 6cyls !!

[Jimcdbts]

The industrial 592E engine was rated to 57hp at 2250 rpm but was rated to nearer 70 hp for the truck. The 590E was rated to max 89hp at 2250 rpm while the turbocharged 590E had a max rating of 120hp at 2250rpm.

[1su9pm6aj4]

So putting a turbo on a major engine is not a good idea...I can live with that. My interest came about watching Jay Lenos Garage on utube... He has 100's of premium cars and one of his rides is a specially designed Peterbuilt truck that has a Detroit Diesel V 12, 2 cycle with twin blowers, The slang name for that engine is the buzzen dozen, its 840 cubic inches. That was the underpowered version from Detroit, another version added twin turbos to the blowers. jay's version put out 500 HP and 10000 ft pounds of torque. That's what got me thinking of a turbo and my engine.
Good day today, I got the front gears all installed, timing cover attached, oil pump in , and oil pan on (hope it doesn't leak). I saw the date April 13th 1964 stamped into the inside of the oil pan, also G C or C G.

Saw a brand new Minimic mechanical pump on ebay last night for 2400 dollars or something like that. It was new old stock, wish I had the bucks. I will soon have to get mine tested.

When I get to them, is there a blow up picture of the injectors with placement of copper washers? besides being short of some washers (I took them apart so long ago) I don't know where they go inside the injector, I know one is between the head and injector outside the injector . My manual says nothing about it. Any help will be appreciated.... Kerry

[1su9pm6aj4]

Some pics of my project

How do you post pictures from your own device? I have an iPad mini. Do not see where to click on this reply page to source pictures from my iPad . Can anyone help me out?

Thanks Kerry

[Dandy Dave]

In a nut shell...You need to load your photos to a place like Photo bucket, or Image Shack. And then click the "Img" above and paste the photo link between the pop up. If the photo does not come up, you will need to edit it and reduce the size so it fits the screen. But this you may already know. Dandy Dave!

[1su9pm6aj4]

Can't source pics from our own device? O k then I guess it's photobucket.

Can't work on major for the next ten days, leaving town for the holidays.

Thanks to those who answered my questions, merry Christmas ! Kerry

[1su9pm6aj4]

Help! When I try to post an image from photobucket, I click on the img above, it lands in the text area, then I click on it and nothing happens except img turns red. I have right clicked and left clicked...still nothing.. Kerry

[Dandy Dave]

It has to go between where the periods are, like this. [img]........[/img] I copy the "direct link" tab in photo bucket and then paste it there. Dandy Dave!