Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Lack of smoke certainly sounds like a fuel problem, it may be pumping fuel to the injectors but if the pump plungers are only partially moving there won't be enough pressure to open the injector nozzle. Have had succes before with stuck plungers by removing the injector pipes and the fuel inlet to the pump an using a smal funnel with a small piece of rubber pipe on it and pouring thin penetrating oil into the pump. Turn the engine over on the starter to get the oil right through the pump and leave it for a day or so (just be sure to cover the top of the injector pump with a rag when cranking the engine as the oil will come out at high pressure!). Reconnect the lines and remove them from the injectors and bleed the pump again, if all seems OK try starting again and see if you have any smoke, if you do but it will not fire remove the air pipe and use an electric heat gun to get hot air into the inlet as you crank the engine. If you still have no smoke then as Sandy says you may well need to get the injectors tested It may also be worth (if you can) trying to tow start it, if the engine has sat for a long time or been siezed (frozen) the piston rings can stick in the grooves resulting in low compression, the starter motor will not crank the engine fast enough to overcome the lack of compression but towing it will spin the engine alot faster just make sure the clutch is free before you tow it!!!!
My biggest fear is that when i die my wife will sell my tractors for what i told her they cost
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Thanks for the pictures and explanations.
Work and rain today, so not sure if I'll be with Daisy today.
I hadn't taken the air intake hose off because the clamps are seized and the hose is not torn or collapsed. It has a solid feeling not pliable at all, maybe this is an issue. I will remove it and inspect..
Will recheck timing as well. Initially thought I could feel, but not see the pointer on front of engine. Notch in pulley seemed lined up with what I thought was timer, and injector marks lined up perfect, with bolt on bottom.
Now with the loader removed I also loosened belt off dynamo and swung it down to have a better look and I'm not so sure about the pointer being there!?
There is no window in the sump and there is the notch in the pulley. I'll try to clean it up more and get a picture. The shop manual picture looks like the pointer would be hard to miss.
Forgot to mention I have not checked tappet adjustment due to missing feeler gauge.If this seems imperative I'll give up the search and buy a new set.
Work and rain today, so not sure if I'll be with Daisy today.
I hadn't taken the air intake hose off because the clamps are seized and the hose is not torn or collapsed. It has a solid feeling not pliable at all, maybe this is an issue. I will remove it and inspect..
Will recheck timing as well. Initially thought I could feel, but not see the pointer on front of engine. Notch in pulley seemed lined up with what I thought was timer, and injector marks lined up perfect, with bolt on bottom.
Now with the loader removed I also loosened belt off dynamo and swung it down to have a better look and I'm not so sure about the pointer being there!?
There is no window in the sump and there is the notch in the pulley. I'll try to clean it up more and get a picture. The shop manual picture looks like the pointer would be hard to miss.
Forgot to mention I have not checked tappet adjustment due to missing feeler gauge.If this seems imperative I'll give up the search and buy a new set.
Last edited by leeroy on Tue Nov 26, 2024 12:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
1939 Ford 9N, 1952 8N, 1955 FMD, IH 340U, Ford 3600, Ford 2120, Valmet 646 Forwarder.
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Thanks @John b
I'm wondering if seeing the injector pump with cover off does not show me what you said. In other words I thought the plungers were moving correctly but they may not be making full travel?
I wish we could try pulling it but we have one blown rear tire and the front right steering spindle is fairly seized. If I can get steering issue resolved I would go after swapping a rear tire.
Look forward to trying the heat gun if need be.
I'm leaning towards the injectors being the culprit. There was solid crud in the fuel shutoff, the lift pump, and the line between both.in my layman's mind the injectors have the smallest tolerance so anything that makes it past filter and injector pump would stop at injectors?
I'm wondering if seeing the injector pump with cover off does not show me what you said. In other words I thought the plungers were moving correctly but they may not be making full travel?
I wish we could try pulling it but we have one blown rear tire and the front right steering spindle is fairly seized. If I can get steering issue resolved I would go after swapping a rear tire.
Look forward to trying the heat gun if need be.
I'm leaning towards the injectors being the culprit. There was solid crud in the fuel shutoff, the lift pump, and the line between both.in my layman's mind the injectors have the smallest tolerance so anything that makes it past filter and injector pump would stop at injectors?
1939 Ford 9N, 1952 8N, 1955 FMD, IH 340U, Ford 3600, Ford 2120, Valmet 646 Forwarder.
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
I doubt the hot air will make the difference with no smoke, the tappet clearances are worth checking but when hot. If the pointer isn't there you'll have to find TDC then check, although from what you say the timing should be reasonable (in other words the engine should run even if not very well). Is plunger no. 1 coming up when you have that all lined up? If it's no.4 (unlikely) the pump was timed half a turn out and needs to be removed and turned half a turn before refitting. Other than that I would test the injectors, they're probably dribling (which can happen because of a stuck needle valve). Anything that gets past the filter will cause wear on the plungers, barrels, delivery valves and guides, and injector needle valves and nozzle bodies.
Sandy
Sandy
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Not a great picture of where I think the pointer should be.
Going to go over the starter as I should've Sandy. Think Daisy was turning to slow.

Rain and work today. Hopefully time to play tomorrow.
Going to go over the starter as I should've Sandy. Think Daisy was turning to slow.

Rain and work today. Hopefully time to play tomorrow.
1939 Ford 9N, 1952 8N, 1955 FMD, IH 340U, Ford 3600, Ford 2120, Valmet 646 Forwarder.
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
I don't see it unfortunately. This is the shot in the manual of the diesel one, the spark ignition ones are different as they're timed more retarded and each have a different pointer.

You want to look in a scrapy for one, but no real hurry as you can manage without it for now. Slow turning should still show smoke, so although I do recommend you check the starter I think the injectors need a check. Don't overlook cleaning terminals and connectors.
I'm hoping for a play tomorrow too.
Sandy

You want to look in a scrapy for one, but no real hurry as you can manage without it for now. Slow turning should still show smoke, so although I do recommend you check the starter I think the injectors need a check. Don't overlook cleaning terminals and connectors.
I'm hoping for a play tomorrow too.
Sandy
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Ok thanks for the picture. Looks a bit different than the one in my repair manual. I'll post a picture.
Can we use 24volts from a jump pack directly to starter or is that a terrible idea?
Our jumper cables are also suspect. Daisy is a bit boxed in with the remains of her loader. I may move that today in order to get one our trucks in close for a jump. I assume with good cables I'd get a better amps from truck with two newer batteries vs Hyacinth's one used older battery?
Can we use 24volts from a jump pack directly to starter or is that a terrible idea?
Our jumper cables are also suspect. Daisy is a bit boxed in with the remains of her loader. I may move that today in order to get one our trucks in close for a jump. I assume with good cables I'd get a better amps from truck with two newer batteries vs Hyacinth's one used older battery?
1939 Ford 9N, 1952 8N, 1955 FMD, IH 340U, Ford 3600, Ford 2120, Valmet 646 Forwarder.
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Don't use 24V or the starter will melt! Clean the jumper cable connectors, the thicker and cleaner the better. A big battery is definitely worth it, Super Billy has this in.

Twin batteries are only possible on the Super Major and should be 2 6V units in series. Super Billy still has the single battery tray and clamp but that's because here twin batteries were never used. I have seen two 12V batteries in parallel but there are issues with that.
Sandy

Twin batteries are only possible on the Super Major and should be 2 6V units in series. Super Billy still has the single battery tray and clamp but that's because here twin batteries were never used. I have seen two 12V batteries in parallel but there are issues with that.
Sandy
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Getting ready to dismantle starter and have a look. Had checked brushes earlier and they looked ok and moved with ease. What else should I be looking for? I took the starter off the Super, but in barely spins when connected directly to battery. The band around the brushes was badly rusted and the brushes are stuck. What can be used to free these up? Figure I may as well tinker on them both. Tempted to take starter out of Hyacinth but have misgivings on that idea.
This morning I tried to jump Daisy direct to starter with our Ford 2120 that has a good battery. It turned as slow as it did doing same with Hyacinth.
Was able to get my truck in close enough for direct jump to starter. It was only slightly faster on the starter. We had one puff of smoke and she was close.
Frustrated at not seeing more smoke, I decided to take the exhaust and intake manifolds off. They were both packed with oily acorns. I also removed them from the ports. Now we are getting smoke but no fire. I really need to get it spinning over fast, we feel like she'd start.
This morning I tried to jump Daisy direct to starter with our Ford 2120 that has a good battery. It turned as slow as it did doing same with Hyacinth.
Was able to get my truck in close enough for direct jump to starter. It was only slightly faster on the starter. We had one puff of smoke and she was close.
Frustrated at not seeing more smoke, I decided to take the exhaust and intake manifolds off. They were both packed with oily acorns. I also removed them from the ports. Now we are getting smoke but no fire. I really need to get it spinning over fast, we feel like she'd start.
1939 Ford 9N, 1952 8N, 1955 FMD, IH 340U, Ford 3600, Ford 2120, Valmet 646 Forwarder.
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
It sounds like the brushes are ok, is the commutator nice and smooth or pitted? If pitted you need to polish it, a lathe is ideal but this could be done just by powering the starter and holding sandpaper with a block of wood through the holes in the yoke. I wouldn't dismantle it yet, the Super one might well improve with the same treatment, although you'll need to free the brushes with petrol first (it probably will need to be taken apart as rust won't help at all). Don't disturb Hyacinth, let her do the work! I recommend you clean the terminals, it will make a difference. Don't try to run with the manifolds off as you'll loose the governor in doing so. Having said that it looks like all you need is persuation now (the hot air might do it now). Where did all those acorns come from?
Sandy
Sandy
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Daisy started!!
I'd say she runs pretty decent for how long she's been parked.
I took the starter apart and the armature had light rust in spots. Sandy this was before I read your post, hopefully using a wire brush on an angle grinder was not to harsh. It seemed to fix the slow tickover. Luckily I did not start it without the manifolds. Again I got your post after starting.
Did not run her for long as the belt snapped when I was tensioning it.
One thing I noticed was the stop control lever would cut fuel off at 12 o'clock position, if that makes sense. It was all the way forward when running..Hyacinth runs normal at 12oclock and fuel shuts off when pulled back towards seat. Is this just different because of years or is something wrong with one of them? There is not a fuel shutoff cable on Daisy yet
Oil pressure gauge is in bad shape, hoping to address that so we will know pressure is ok.
Thanks so much! Unfortunately I was solo, so no video, but we'll get one.
The acorn's? Not sure if it's mice or chipmunks. How they got in there is beyond me. The exhaust elbow was covered with a large coffee can.
Same thing happened to my wife's air intake and filter housing.
I'd say she runs pretty decent for how long she's been parked.
I took the starter apart and the armature had light rust in spots. Sandy this was before I read your post, hopefully using a wire brush on an angle grinder was not to harsh. It seemed to fix the slow tickover. Luckily I did not start it without the manifolds. Again I got your post after starting.
Did not run her for long as the belt snapped when I was tensioning it.
One thing I noticed was the stop control lever would cut fuel off at 12 o'clock position, if that makes sense. It was all the way forward when running..Hyacinth runs normal at 12oclock and fuel shuts off when pulled back towards seat. Is this just different because of years or is something wrong with one of them? There is not a fuel shutoff cable on Daisy yet
Oil pressure gauge is in bad shape, hoping to address that so we will know pressure is ok.
Thanks so much! Unfortunately I was solo, so no video, but we'll get one.
The acorn's? Not sure if it's mice or chipmunks. How they got in there is beyond me. The exhaust elbow was covered with a large coffee can.
Same thing happened to my wife's air intake and filter housing.
1939 Ford 9N, 1952 8N, 1955 FMD, IH 340U, Ford 3600, Ford 2120, Valmet 646 Forwarder.
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Great news! Looks like it was rust in the starter so give the Super one a good clean too. The stop lever position sounds strange, as the rack and governor parts are the same as Hyacinth, what is different is the stop lever and excess fuel device as you pull the lever out to get excess fuel. Daisy is one of the last with that, as they changed it from 1299000. Hyacinth sounds to behave normally. The Super should also be the same. Pitty about the gauge, a scrapy is the best source as the new ones are really poor and look wrong anyway.
Sounds like there are lots of acorn eaters who like storing them in vehicles round you! I am amazed they got in, but there you go, over here the typical animal to occupy a vehicle is the wasp, which makes using something with them pretty risky.
Sandy
Sounds like there are lots of acorn eaters who like storing them in vehicles round you! I am amazed they got in, but there you go, over here the typical animal to occupy a vehicle is the wasp, which makes using something with them pretty risky.
Sandy
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel




Slow progress on the steering spindle. Can you see the bend in the long rod?
Looks like the air cleaner oil cup from the Super fits Daisy's air cleaner. Daisy's cleaner has the non removable element in the main body, while the Supers is removable. Also the Supers bottom looks like a replacement because it has a brown primer that I see on many aftermarket parts.
Daisy has the solid filler neck, so I only need upper and lower radiator hoses.
1939 Ford 9N, 1952 8N, 1955 FMD, IH 340U, Ford 3600, Ford 2120, Valmet 646 Forwarder.
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
I'm afraid the bowls are not interchangeable, even if they both fit. They're from different manufacturers and mixing them can cause all sorts of trouble. A scrapy should be of use to find a better bowl, you could also try to fix the original one (difficult). The Super's one is original, repro ones look quite different to both, are you sure it's not dirt? Removable elements came in January 55. Glad the spindle is progressing. Not ideal to have that bend but there were some tractors that had a bent drag link from the factory (narrow Ebro tractors come to mind). Solid fillers surived till February 55, so Hyacinth might still have one, the odd one was used up later, as Billy has one too.
Sandy
Sandy
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
I'll get a better picture of the air filter bottoms. The Supers was filled with fuel as I try to clean it. Curious what the difference is between the two bottoms are? The measurements were all the same. Would I be able to take the complete air cleaner off the Super and put it on Daisy?
Unfortunately there are no close scrappys around. @Dandy Dave has told me about one but I have never had time for the trip there.I've contacted distant ones for parts in the past for Hyacinth but haven't had any luck.
Here's a picture of Hyacinth's water pump. I've tried to remove hub with puller, but it won't budge and the puller always starts walking off shaft.
Unless I can get this apart I'll have to get an Agriline pump, which is what I did for Hyacinth and why I have this as a spare, just needs a seal.


Sandy I forgot Hyacinth did have the solid filler neck as well. I've kept that radiator for future re core, but replaced it with an aftermarket.
If I recall record was going to be near $700 and replacement was $150.
Unfortunately there are no close scrappys around. @Dandy Dave has told me about one but I have never had time for the trip there.I've contacted distant ones for parts in the past for Hyacinth but haven't had any luck.
Here's a picture of Hyacinth's water pump. I've tried to remove hub with puller, but it won't budge and the puller always starts walking off shaft.
Unless I can get this apart I'll have to get an Agriline pump, which is what I did for Hyacinth and why I have this as a spare, just needs a seal.


Sandy I forgot Hyacinth did have the solid filler neck as well. I've kept that radiator for future re core, but replaced it with an aftermarket.
If I recall record was going to be near $700 and replacement was $150.
1939 Ford 9N, 1952 8N, 1955 FMD, IH 340U, Ford 3600, Ford 2120, Valmet 646 Forwarder.
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Unfortunately no. The Super filter has the breather pipe and also brackets for the regulator, and those are important for the Super. Pitty about the scrappys but if you could ask around you never know, ebay might be of use too but much of what I see is nowhere near you. I see Hyacinth has had a new water pump before, that's a Mk2 type body (E1ADKN-8505B, a true EnFo one, don't loose it!), all you need to pull off is the impeller, you only need to take it completely apart to replace the bearing or body. I think you might need a bigger puller. Quite keen to see the rest of the pump, it looks to be in pretty good condition. I don't understand why recores are so expensive, but the aftermarket radiators are wrong, they're only 5 fins per inch rather than the 10 fins per inch that both Daisy and Hyacinth should have, and no solid filler. Not too big a deal unless the engine is petrol or worse TVO, as they really need the 10 fins per inch. 5 fins per inch was for Diesel engines after 1420356. Make sure you hold on to original radiators, what was wrong with Hyacinth's one?
Sandy
Sandy
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel

Here is another one, let me know if you want a different angle.
I'll try a bigger puller.
Hyacinth's radiator had a lot of leaks. That 5 fins per inch difference is noticeable in the weight difference. Hoping Daisy's radiator is leak free.
Do people remove thermostats to get by a leaking radiator? Is there not as much pressure? I feel like the leaking started when I discovered no thermostat in Hyacinth when I was replacing water pump and fitted thermostat.
1939 Ford 9N, 1952 8N, 1955 FMD, IH 340U, Ford 3600, Ford 2120, Valmet 646 Forwarder.
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
What a beauty, this is just like what the Super should have, love the EnFo on the hub. When refitting the impeller it needs to be at 0.030" from the body. You could try some stuff in to remove the leaks but it's not ideal. Depends on where too, as if they're in the tanks they're normally easier to solder than if it's in the core. There will be a difference, but it makes the radiator able to dissipate more heat which the petrol engine needs (and the TVO even more, this is the one that actually needs the shutters). I've not heard of someone removing the thermostat because of leaks, the pressure will be dependant on the cap, as a pressure cap allows an extra 4 lbs in the system, allowing better operation. Be careful with the Super if you need a new thermostat, as it needs a shrouded one (not available unless it's an old unused one as sold back then).
Sandy
Sandy
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Now that I've got the air cleaners side by side and somewhat clean the difference is apparent.
Thinking I may be able to salvage Daisy's. Maybe use a steel can if I can find the right size. If I get diameter and height correct we may be ok? I'll study how it should mate up with element using Hyacinth's, along with trying to find one.


Thinking I may be able to salvage Daisy's. Maybe use a steel can if I can find the right size. If I get diameter and height correct we may be ok? I'll study how it should mate up with element using Hyacinth's, along with trying to find one.


1939 Ford 9N, 1952 8N, 1955 FMD, IH 340U, Ford 3600, Ford 2120, Valmet 646 Forwarder.
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Seeing it a bit cleaner I think you might just be able to weld it back to shape, it only looks like a single break with all the stuff there. Not easy welding though, maybe your friend can help. I see what you were saying about paint, I think that came from AC before Ford put the blue on.
Sandy
Sandy
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
Back to that stuck steering spindle, I never got more movement in either direction after rigging up the long pipe. I will try to get a picture of the furthest points left and right. Those take a lot of effort with the pipe.
Wondering what next step might be? Guessing somehow removing and replacing all related parts.

Wondering what next step might be? Guessing somehow removing and replacing all related parts.

1939 Ford 9N, 1952 8N, 1955 FMD, IH 340U, Ford 3600, Ford 2120, Valmet 646 Forwarder.
Re: Next move for our 1954 Fordson Major Diesel
I think you need more oil and diesel, the cold won't help bet shouldn't be a big issue. You could always park something nearby and work it with the exhaust pointing at the spindle (not easy but might be worth it for 10 minutes or so). that might give you a bit of extra movement, don't get the exhaust too close though. Just a thought. I say an exhaus to make it easier to avoid the issues with heat, normal diesel exhaust is at a suitable temperature (I think you mentioned you had a heat gun, that might do too but again don't get it too hot, not above 400ºF max, any more will cause permanent damage which can only be fixed by doing full heat treatments as Ford did).
Sandy
Sandy