PTO problems on Ford 5000

[tobac]

A friend purchased a 71 model Ford 5000. The previous owner said PTO and 3PL were working although there was a few second delay before the PTO shaft turned after you moved the lever. When he got it home the PTO and 3 pl were not working. Many days later after much trial and error the 3pl started working. I assume a valve was stuck somewhere. The pto is still not working. A gauge has been put in the test point on rhs under foot plate. It reads 40 to 50 psi which I believe is too low. I have just seen the following post on another forum and I am wondering if it has any relevance.
XXXXXXXX
Topped off the transmission and hydraulic fluids. I was in too much of a hurry so I removed the wrong bolt when I went to remove the fill level plug. I removed a 9/16th bolt that is in the left side of the transmission just above the left floor board. The bolt is several inches ahead of the PTO lever. When I removed the bolt, it had about 1/2 inch of thread near the head of the bolt and then a the rest of the bolt is about an inch long pin that sticks inside of the rear axle/hydraulic system case.

Once I saw that I had removed the wrong bolt, I tried to replace it. It was difficult to replace in that I couldn't insert it all the way in to catch the threads. I finally got it in and tightened down. Now, when I engage the PTO lever, I get nothing. It doesn't make any different sounds, it just doesn't engage the PTO.
XXXXXXX.
Any thoughts appreciated. This tractor also has power steering problems. No assist at all. The oil reservoir was empty and when filled the oil drained away internally. I guess a seal may be gone. Any suggestions where to buy parts at a good price appreciated. Thanks.

[Kiwi Kev]

Hi tobac
Welcome to the forum, and where are you located?
There are'nt too many 5000 posters on here, however I have recently aquired one.
My one also had power steering issues, and pto issues.
My ps was mainly adjustment of tierod lengths and hose routing.
My 3pl did raise/lower, but the pto would not drive. I pulled the top off the rear transmission and the little plastic pipe that supplies oil to the pto clutch pack had a split in it. Replaced the hose and away she went.
The special bolt that you mentioned holds the pto clutch pack in the correct location. Even though the bolt went back in the hole, theres no guarantee that the clutch pack had'nt rotated while the bolt was out of the hole. If it has rotated, then the pto lever won't connect with the valve to engage the pto.
However, I think you have more important things than the pto not turning. You should have more than 50psi oil pressure.
I would be removing the top cover of the rear transmission to access the pto clutch pack, and to view the hydraulic pump. To remove the hyd pump, you need to remove the RH foot plate
Let us know how you get on.
Kiwi Kev

[tobac]

Thanks for the response. Your comments are helpful. I am located in Buffalo River Australia.

[tobac]

We took the top from the linkage to see what was happening inside. PTO drum was very rusty. PTO could not be turned. I removed the brake and checked the sealing rings. I put air pressure on PTO clutch and it locked up OK. When released the pressure it freed up OK. Looks like the PTO was the problem. The oil line was OK. I put air pressure on PTO valve when pressure pipe is attached and air was escaping from oil bleed hole half way along the bracket. It was escaping with the PTO lever in either position. The brake did not move and hence the PTO was locked from turning.Is there a problem in the control valve. Tomorrow I intend to put oil pressure into port on outside of pump where you check the pressure. This I believe should pressurise the PTO valve and if there is a major leak it should show up. Am I on the right track. Cheers.

[texacoon]

Code: Select all

The special bolt that you mentioned holds the pto clutch pack in the correct location. Even though the bolt went back in the hole, theres no guarantee that the clutch pack had'nt rotated while the bolt was out of the hole. If it has rotated, then the pto lever won't connect with the valve to engage the pto.

WOW! It makes me wonder just how many people removed this bolt ????

I did the same thing this past weekend thinking it was my transmission oil level. Now my PTO doesn't work .. where it was working fine before until I pulled this bolt out ...
So, what is the fix???? does anyone have any photos or drawings they could post on fixing this?

Thanks!

[Brian]

The only way to replace the bolt is to take the lift off and make sure the bolt locates in the clutch pack.

Really, the answer to the problem is read the handbook, the level plug on a 5000 has never been on the rear axle housing in that position. It was originally located at the rear down near the PTO shaft or a dipstick either on the left side rear or on the gearbox filler plug when the tractor has combined gearbox and rear axle oil.

Another point is that Ford nearly always used square headed plugs for level plugs.

[ford5000y]

Hi tobac
Welcome to the forum, and where are you located?
There are'nt too many 5000 posters on here, however I have recently aquired one.
My one also had power steering issues, and pto issues.
My ps was mainly adjustment of tierod lengths and hose routing.
My 3pl did raise/lower, but the pto would not drive. I pulled the top off the rear transmission and the little plastic pipe that supplies oil to the pto clutch pack had a split in it. Replaced the hose and away she went.
The special bolt that you mentioned holds the pto clutch pack in the correct location. Even though the bolt went back in the hole, theres no guarantee that the clutch pack had'nt rotated while the bolt was out of the hole. If it has rotated, then the pto lever won't connect with the valve to engage the pto.
However, I think you have more important things than the pto not turning. You should have more than 50psi oil pressure.
I would be removing the top cover of the rear transmission to access the pto clutch pack, and to view the hydraulic pump. To remove the hyd pump, you need to remove the RH foot plate
Let us know how you get on.
Kiwi Kev

We own a 1971 model ford 5000 (it says April 1971on the mounting lug) It was reconditioned but it has some bits the restorer hadn't gone to check. For instance, the inlet of the fuel lift pump has loose, in fact very loose thread (I have managed to repair that) and also the pto has some problem that is still waiting to be repaired ( pto won't engage or disengage when the engine is running except if you would stop and restart the tractor again, well, it depends) but since pto jobs aren't prevalent here in our area (no one, in fact uses rotavators in breaking down soil, a quick shallow job on the disc harrow would be their answer) and it wasn't developing into something really serious, we have decided to just live with it until we have got the time to repair it.

[texacoon]

The only way to replace the bolt is to take the lift off and make sure the bolt locates in the clutch pack.

Really, the answer to the problem is read the handbook, the level plug on a 5000 has never been on the rear axle housing in that position. It was originally located at the rear down near the PTO shaft or a dipstick either on the left side rear or on the gearbox filler plug when the tractor has combined gearbox and rear axle oil.

Another point is that Ford nearly always used square headed plugs for level plugs.

Thanks Brian .... Will certainly look into it as soon as the weather starts to warm up a bit ...
I'm located in Missouri ... this morning it was 0 degrees here .. where as last Sunday was 54 ... Been having some really weird weather this year ...
YUP! Thanks for the "How To Do It" ... For some reason someone told me there was a spring that may have fallen off ... They said you would have to fish for it ... I was wondering if that is true or not ... As far as having a handbook .. "don't have one" ....

[Brian]

Here you are. On some 5000s the square headed plug could be a square socket-headed plug.

The bottom picture is from the 6600 hand book but the tractors are very similar.

[texacoon]

Thanks so much Brian! This is what I needed

We recently moved and most of my books are in boxes (somewhere) really didn't want to buy another book knowing I have one in a box somewhere...

Thanks!

[brockwood]

hi a follow-on to the previous posts just got a 5000 slectospeed quite a good deal stopped on the previous owner fuming badly sounds like it might have done a piston any way for those how don’t know two of the bands are held off by oil and applied by springs so if you stall or put it in park two gears are on at once and that what holds it .there’s a dog clutch on the diff that you can put out to tow it when its stopped he didn’t know and had dragged the wheels home any way went to pick it up and couldn’t get the clutch out so had to drag it on got it home and pulled the linkage off to see why the clutch wouldn't move and found the pto valve body had dropped as somewon had undone the retaining bolt and it has no choice but to sit right in the clutch groove thus locking it easy fixed but a pain and i thought might be handy for others to know b