The Fordson Tractor Pages Forum

Insurance of SORN'ed vehicles.

This subject was discussed some time ago on here when it was first proposed, now it is here!! We have until the 31st March 2017 to register our displeasure on the DVLA web site.

It looks like it is covering ALL vehicles no matter what state they are in or if they are partailly dismantled and being worked on. (Not sure about scrapped ones but they too may be included).

It does not matter if they are kept on private land, they will have to be insured.

Contact: http://www.smartsurvey.co.uk/s/4CWY6/ and make you thoughts known, 31/3/2017 is the deadline.


Another SORN story. Ann's Cougar is on its way to the scrap yard in the sky as it failed its MOT with bad corrosion on the rear chassis. So we tried to SORN it whilst we find a buyer, (leather seats and a V6 engine in very good condition anybody)?

It is not easy to do this part way through a year. DVLA wants a 16 digit number from the reg. document. All numbers Ann finds are invalid. Finally gets human being at Swansea not a computer.

"Just use the reg number",

Not valid, no such vehicle on register.

Go through the system again and get back to human being 2.

"Oh No that won't work Mrs Dye, I can see you own the car and it is licenced and insured but we need the 16 digit number".

"What 16 digit number"?

"The one on your licence reminder".

" But you all keep telling me that it is not valid".

"Oh yes, it is out of date".

"So where do you get a new one"?

"You get one with your new licence reminder, please do not use language like that Mrs Dye".

Eventually we discover that the number they want is on the green form that replaced the log book but no one told us that, just kept repeating that the number was on the licence reminder.

(I had not heard Ann use language like that ever, but after three hours of going around in circles with the DVLA, I understood).

Completed my form on line. Typical government form with lots of ambiguous questions but stick with it.

Do you want me to save you and Ann a cartridge apiece Brian ? theyre like the Marshall ones but have got some heavy little balls of soft metal in em

Have they defined exactly WHAT these non roadgoing vehicles need insuring against, and indeed what actually comprises a vehicle - they screwed up big time in 'value adding' the pressure directive by overlooking the thousands of small scale steam models using boilers - rest of Europe had no problem implementing it.

When are they going to do the same with horses and rid our roads of those dangerous menaces I wonder

And so to bed, fuming

Rick

I can see it killing the few remaining museums

The problem seems to be, according to Peter Love, a Slovenian operator, in Slovenia, got injured by an uninsured old tractor on private land then found he could not get compensation. What that has to do with third party insurance on the vehicle I do not know, we have personal liability insurance to cover things like that.

If someone trips over a tractor in my yard (and that IS possible) then the claim is against me and does not matter whether the tractor is insured or not. A different matter if the tractor is on the road and un-insured but, Hey, what about all these uninsured cars tearing around our roads at the moment with no MOT or licence.

I suppose old vehicles, in a yard are static and easier to hit!

Yes Brian, I think that is right.

The landowner is responsible for anything that happens on his land, so if someone is hurt by a tractor, quad, bike, ...., that is the same as a tree falling on someone's head, being attacked by his cows or an electric shock.

As you say, all landowners should have 3rd party cover + employee liability which would include anyone 'working' on the pr0perty, paid or unpaid. 'Work' is a very broad term and could include even a family member helping out.

Yes but the farmers are not the problem by and large, thing of all the weekend countryfolk wellying around on quads and trikes, juggling chain saws and strimmers, they (and particularly their offspring) are the real menace these days, once they were content just to run you off the road with their Rangies & Jags and the bl@@dy horses of course

I would have thought occupiers liability was sufficient for this already to be covered but what do I know

Don't forget to registrer your bikes folks

Dunno about the Netherlands Henk but in the UK a vehicle is a mechanically powered wheeled or tracked conveyance so motorbike, jet powered skateboard, propelled lawnmower etc are 'vehicles' and need registering or licensing if used on the road, our DVLA can't manage their current remit of already licenced road vehicles let alone expect them to be able to manage all the rest (as Brians tale of the exasperated Ann well illustrates)

It doesn't appear they invested any of the financial gain from closing all their regional offices in training their staff in Swansea, or even issuing them with a 'Bible' of what response applies to what situation. Never mind their huge profits from selling the so called desirable registration numbers.

I despair sometimes, is it just the perspective of experience and understanding gained as you get older or is 98% of the world going BL@@DY CRAZY ?

Rick, with a sprinkling of snow outside

The facts of the original case make the idea even more ridiculous.

The Slovenian claimant was knocked off a ladder by a tractor reversing a load of bales into a shed on private land. He tried to claim against the tractor drivers insurance but the company threw it out as the tractor was on private land and "the tractor was not being used as a vehicle" at the time it was reversing into the barn.

He went to court and eventually won his case hence the EU directive.

So it is possible the tractor was insured, say, for showing or travelling on the road but not for use as an agricultural tractor or for use in agriculture. This is something we might find in our own insurance.

Still think that the claim is against the farmer/driver public liability rather than the vehicle insurance though otherwise why have public liability?

What do our European friends think as this directive is already applying to them?

Hi,

seems a special case in that country.
In Germany every motorized vehicle has an insurance, and yes Henk, even my bike, because it's electrically powered and may reach 45km/h.

In this case (work on a farm), a normal running farm has an insurance for the whole "company" to cover such accidents. This is the same in every company, even in a Bank has something like this. There are different insurances for different types of companies, we call it "Berufsgenossenschaft". Every company has to be member of one.

If you have an accident on your way from home to work or back (straight line), you are insured.

If you are working in private at home on your car (or a friends one) and you make a mistake and get injured (happened to me 25 years ago), the accident counted as a "working accident" and not as a car accident, because it was not the normal use of the car that led to that accident.
So my friend as the owner of that car was counted as the "boss" of a workshop and the insurance for car workshops payed the bills for me. Not the insurance of the car. My friend never payed for that insurance, neither before or after the accident.

Peter

Overhere we have bikes with gas engines and electrical support to 40 km/u. Both do need a license. The normal electric support bike to 27 km/u needs no license.

Hi Henk,

same here. The 25km/h E-Bikes run without numberplate as a normal bicycle.

Peter