1953 vs. 1960 Parts

[Mermilliod]

Hello everyone,

I have a multipart question for the community. I just bought a 1953 Diesel Major and am in the process of trying to get it running again after who knows how many years as a blackberry planter.

I am in need of a starter as mine is MIA. I have located a 1960 Fordson with a cracked block and the head has been removed for "repair" for 2+ years.

So here goes:

1. Will the starter be the same between 53-60?

2. What other parts are the same/radically different? I am interested in sheet metal, rims/tires, intake/exhaust parts, and anything else that is better repair/condition than mine.

3. What is a fair market price for a clunker of a tractor like this in the US? I am considering trying to buy the whole thing vs. parts which he is willing to do

4. I understand the later motor is more powerful. Is it the same architecture, bigger bore/stroke, and/or a completely different motor? If the head is a better design or some other part, can it be swapped to the earlier motor to inprove performance?

Thanks in advance,
Jeffrey

[BearCreek Majors]

Hi Jeffrey.
I believe the starters are the same and should bolt right on. The newer tractor is essentially the same but there are a few differences. Other than live PTO and the obvious difference in the dash/instrument cluster, the engine has several updates to it as well. The head and manifold design is different but can be swapped as a set. Other internals such as crank, rods, cam and timing gears have been updated as well. As far as swapping the head or a few other parts to get more power from yours, I wouldn’t do so without changing all the internals, the early cranks were known to be a little on the weak side and would most likely not take more hp. If you 53 runs reasonably well I would leave it as is.
If it were my decision to make, I would be strongly looking at fixing the 60 as it will have live PTO. I do believe other than some minor differences in the block design (such as throttle linkage location), the 60 parts will bolt in and on the early block. I personally would have a hard time doing such if the 53 runs and is in relatively good shape.
I’m thinking the only logical thing to do is what most everyone on FTP would do, bring them both home to fix up, you can never have too many Fordsons!

Where in the US are you located? Getting the “junk” one for a few hundred bucks would be a great deal, $500 and up seems to be the norm, I have seen some non running units go for more than a grand, for that price it had better have really good tires and a cute daughter to go with it. In the long run you may be money ahead to leave the cute daughter behind!

Pat

[Mermilliod]

Pat,

Thank you for the info. My 53 is not yet running (has no starter) but it looks promising so far. I have drained the fuel tank and aside from a wooden spoon (?!) the tank looks clean. I pulled the intake/exhaust manifold and looked inside the head at the valves- pretty clean/no water penetration. Pulled the dipstick and the oil looks/smells good. So I suspect the motor is good and do not plan to do any parts replacements until I can verify it turns over.

I paid $600 for the 53 and think that was a fair price but have nothing to compare that to. I am going to see if the guy will sell me the whole 60 for $400/500 and take it if he will. Two tractors certainly sounds better than one but I am concentrating on getting one to work at the molment.

On the PTO- I am not sure what mine will really have. The dual action bucket is hand made and it has power steering- also added by a farm engineer so who knows what kind of PTO live or otherwise it will have when I get it running.

Jeffrey

[super6954]

Hi
Pat has basically covered most of the things in his post with the motor some early tractors did have a different water pump casting and they are not available complete so may have to buy a rebuild kit if you have that old pump and it leaks
( in all my years I have never had one so that may be rare or I've been lucky ).
There are some other differences in the crankshafts too but i wont bore ya with that now .

The only other things i would comment on is don't assume that all power majors have live pto and hydraulics (two stage Clutch) It was still an option on those and the super majors. I have a dead drive power major here now and I picked up a fire damaged super for parts that was dead drive , these are not the only ones i have seen around in north America so there are a few out there.

The hood might be different too the early ones had the air pre cleaner under the hood and the newer ones had it come through a hole in the hood so that depends on when fords changed them ( I think yours is under the hood) . The fuel tank and the steering box are different too due to the way the gauges are mounted on the top of the fuel tank on the power/ super major so dont swap over to be correct looking .

There are i believe 3 types of fender for the major up to the power major as well , Personally I have only seen 2 types ( single semi circle rib at top That is correct for yours i Believe , or 3 ribs horizontal on face) All fenders from 52 -60 with Brake shaft cut out at the bottom will fit but it depends how original you want to keep the tractor.

Pat seems to be about on the money for Price. I pay about the same up here in Canada for non Runners. I get between 3 and $4000 for fully painted nice tractors with no loaders on,
As he says I would go for fixing the power major if it has live pto and can be got going for sensible money.
PS Can We see some pictures of the tractors
Regards Robert

[JC]

I didn't know that the early diesel Majors had the pre-cleaner under the hood, Robert. I've never seen one. I thought that was only on the petrol/kero ones. Were all the early ones that way, or have you seen them with the pre-cleaner above the hood, too?

Jeffrey,
A Major weighs about 2 1/2 tons. At $175 a ton, that's about $440. That's what I'd offer for it unless it has really good tires, like Pat said.
The vacuum lines and governor housing threads will be different on the '60 also. Is the injector pump capped or has it been left open to the weather?

[Mermilliod]

My hood actually does have the hole in it for the pre-cleaner to stick out- although the tube is missing.

BTW- What is the common thought on sticking with the old school oil bath vs. converting to a more modern filter?

On the pictures- I will be happy to post some and get some thoughts on it, it will just take awhile since I am away from home for the next week.

Thanks,
Jeffrey

[JC]

BTW- What is the common thought on sticking with the old school oil bath vs. converting to a more modern filter?

It depends on how you're going to use the tractor. Oil bath air cleaners don't work very well in really fine dust, especially at low RPMs. If you're not going to be in those conditions much, the oil bath will be fine.

[BearCreek Majors]

[quote="JC"]I didn't know that the early diesel Majors had the pre-cleaner under the hood, Robert. I've never seen one. I thought that was only on the petrol/kero ones. Were all the early ones that way, or have you seen them with the pre-cleaner above the hood, too?


JC, I have seen one Major diesel in a scrap yard that had the precleaner under the hood, but that dosent nessasaraly mean it came from the factory with a diesel.

Pat

[super6954]

Hi JC
I'm Not really sure when the air pre cleaners changed I have a customers tractor that is diesel and 52/53 ish i am working on now. It has the under hood intake, but it has been modified with a hole cut in the hood for a top cleaner. I have had a few hoods from both England and Canada that came off diesels and they had the hole cut or "butchered" into them as well ( not the nice oval with the nice lip around) .
That's really all I can tell you for now I will have to check the serial no on stu's tractor and get the exact date from it.
Regards Robert

[Mermilliod]

For those of you following this thread, I went and saw the 60 today. The guy seems to have misplaced the starter which was the one item I need the most (anybody have one to sell?) and there are parts in the shop, on the ground, in the next yard over, and at a buddy's house across town.

The motor has a crack that runs through the top of the block and across three cylinders so I do not thing the block would be salvagable- I am sure you will let me know if I am wrong. Plus each cylinder is full of water due to the head being off in the rain.

The one nice thing is, it has original rims unlike mine and his have the wheel weights. I have made an agreement with him to buy parts. I really have no need for a second tractor and it is a 3+ hour drive from my house so I am not sure my half ton truck would make the tow anyway. If he lets me cherry pick the thing I will be taking the sheet metal, wheels/tires, seat, gas tank, brake parts, and maybe a few other items.

So what is the trick to uploading photos here?

Jeffrey

[Gman]

Hi Jeff, I recently did a post on how to load pics on here, I believe it was a thread on pump timing. If you do not have a raised pto on your Major and there is one with the parts tractor get it, it is one of the best things to have. Also if the hydraulic pump is in the parts tractor I would go after it also. Good luck on your project.

[super6954]

For those of you following this thread, I went and saw the 60 today. The guy seems to have misplaced the starter which was the one item I need the most (anybody have one to sell?) and there are parts in the shop, on the ground, in the next yard over, and at a buddy's house across town.

The motor has a crack that runs through the top of the block and across three cylinders so I do not thing the block would be salvagable- I am sure you will let me know if I am wrong. Plus each cylinder is full of water due to the head being off in the rain.

The one nice thing is, it has original rims unlike mine and his have the wheel weights. I have made an agreement with him to buy parts. I really have no need for a second tractor and it is a 3+ hour drive from my house so I am not sure my half ton truck would make the tow anyway. If he lets me cherry pick the thing I will be taking the sheet metal, wheels/tires, seat, gas tank, brake parts, and maybe a few other items.

So what is the trick to uploading photos here?

Jeffrey

Hi Jeffrey
Sounds like the end of the power major . But your half ton would tow it if ya go steady and ya half tons a good one . I pulled a major and loader that was fully weighted and fluid in the tires it was a bit heavy on the hills Then i went and picked up a standard super and hauled that a fair distance too on a 24ft goose neck with my GMC 1500 with 5.7 gas and that was fine on the hills.
I'm Kinda thinking that if the price was right I would haul the thing home and get all of it. you can get your parts maybe sell some more and maybe sell the rest for scrap (But pretend I never said that on the fordson forum ) or put your motor in it if it has a live drive transmission it would be less powerfull but still usable all you would need to do is change a peg on the flywheel end of the crank and put the flywheel/ clutch on if your motor has had the steel crank fitted at sometime . Im not sure how long a cast crank would last with the extra weight of the big clutch and flywheel on it before it snapped.
Regards Robert

[Mermilliod]

Well, the guy sold the tractor to another person but sold the starter to me because I needed it pretty badly. Oh well, maybe the other guy will save it.