Super major power steering kit

[frode]

... My 654 had the same setup as the major and your 954. I converted it to real hydraulic steering. You are right, there is no rod coming from the steering box. The factory steering box is replaced with an orbitrol valve with a pressure feed from the power steering pump, return to the reservoir, and 2 lines going to the steering ram. The ram is just a normal double acting unit. Kit is part #6006 at Agriline. You can see how I modified it to use the orginal county bracket for the steering ram on the picture above.

Steering is now as light as on my Chevy full size

Very interesting

Question 1: Is the orbitrol box a direct fit to the Major's steering box?



Question 2: How easy does the steering column attach to the orbitrol unit?


This would be a neat fix for my FPM with a Superior FEL. The steering is still too much for the wife even with an empty bucket

Hi Whirly
I have some sad news on what you asked about these parts
Question 1 No
Question 2 this is a factory unit all in one piece in this kit so unless you got parts to custom build your own it is gonna be hard to do.
Sorry to have to add to your problems and I too wish I lived nearer and could be more help to you.
Just a question here what was the shipping on the kit and customs fees to bring it over if you don't mind me asking.
Regards Robert

Pump will not fit on the major. Maybe you can use the original. Bracket for orbitrol must be modified to fit the major. Should be a quick job with a angle grinder and a welder

The steering shaft is supplied with the kit.

Frode

[whirly]

Just a question here what was the shipping on the kit and customs fees to bring it over if you don't mind me asking.
Regards Robert

If that question was directed at me .... The kit from Agrilne at current exchange rates would be a little over $800 US plus shipping - probably $100+ US. I've never had to pay customs on imported parts for personal use so I don't know.

[super6954]

Just a question here what was the shipping on the kit and customs fees to bring it over if you don't mind me asking.
Regards Robert

If that question was directed at me .... The kit from Agrilne at current exchange rates would be a little over $800 US plus shipping - probably $100+ US. I've never had to pay customs on imported parts for personal use so I don't know.

Thanks Whirly
There is a guy in Ontario selling the kits at $1200 Can . I was thinking he was a bit out of whack on the price but depending on shipping and exchange when he got them I guess he is about right with his cut on too . Was gonna bring a kit over for a tractor I want to sell But will just by his if needed. The saving might not be worth the hassle with Canadian customs .
Regards Robert.

[Wyomiles]

Agriline sells the kit I bought for £250.00 (UK lbs). I also ordered some manuals and a nut for my steering wheel which totaled 52.50 UK lbs. The Fed Ex shipping bill was 75 UK lbs . When it was all said and done I paid 377.5 UK lbs which translated into 596.64 dollars.
My credit card company charged me another 18 bucks because it was a "Foreign transaction" and Fed Ex sent an additional bill for $16.28 which they labeled as Duties,tax,customs and other fees. So all in all the kit alone probable cost me somewhere around 500 dollars.

You guys are right about not being so hard on Agriline I suppose. They do have me over a barrel as far as having things that I can't find elsware. I just find the customer service a little lacking and the advertising a little missleading. If I were a bit more competent as a mechanic It wouldn't be a problem.

I am looking forward to getting back up to the mountains again and using some of the great suggestions you all have shared with me. I will let you know how it goes.

[whirly]

Agriline sells the kit I bought for £250.00 (UK lbs). ... So all in all the kit alone probable cost me somewhere around 500 dollars.

That is Agriline PN 6004 and it actually is a steal at that price

I was referring to the 5000 full power kit PN 6006 they sell for £490.00 (UK lbs) I asked super6954 about to give it real power steering. However, I see the error in my ways. If anything happened to the system that caused it to be inoperable .... you could have no steering. At least with the power assist you may have to overcome the hydraulic fluid in the cylinder but you could still steer.

[frode]

Agriline sells the kit I bought for £250.00 (UK lbs). ... So all in all the kit alone probable cost me somewhere around 500 dollars.

That is Agriline PN 6004 and it actually is a steal at that price

I was referring to the 5000 full power kit PN 6006 they sell for £490.00 (UK lbs) I asked super6954 about to give it real power steering. However, I see the error in my ways. If anything happened to the system that caused it to be inoperable .... you could have no steering. At least with the power assist you may have to overcome the hydraulic fluid in the cylinder but you could still steer.

The orbitrol provide some pumping action. If the pump fail, you can still steer. Alltough on the heavy side

[whirly]

Agriline sells the kit I bought for £250.00 (UK lbs). ... So all in all the kit alone probable cost me somewhere around 500 dollars.

That is Agriline PN 6004 and it actually is a steal at that price

I was referring to the 5000 full power kit PN 6006 they sell for £490.00 (UK lbs) I asked super6954 about to give it real power steering. However, I see the error in my ways. If anything happened to the system that caused it to be inoperable .... you could have no steering. At least with the power assist you may have to overcome the hydraulic fluid in the cylinder but you could still steer.

The orbitrol provide some pumping action. If the pump fail, you can still steer. Alltough on the heavy side

Good to know ... I stand corrected

[shawnee]

Steering kit, this company might have some suggestions!

http://www.tractorpowersteering.com/tra ... g-kits.php

[Dons62FSM]

I just registered for this forum and have a little information to share with the original poster. From what I can see in your photos, you have the same tractor and loader that I do. The loader is a Ford 712 Super Duty Loader. My tractor also has a 723 14' backhoe on it. As someone else mentioned, you need to get the missing bolts replaced in the front cross member. Of the 24 bolts holding the frame to the crossmembers and the center crossmember to the transmission, my tractor had 4 that were in good gondition when I bought it. The frame and center crossmember were severely broken on both sides and the bolt holes in the front crossmember and flywheel housing were nearly all stripped, even though many had been drilled oversize. I have been working a long time to get it all back together. So keep everything tightened up if you want to avoid major damage.

If you look at the photos posted by Pascal you can see three bolts in the frame rail, just to the rear of the four holding the rail to the front crossmember. These bolts hold the front of the motor, going into holes in ears on the front motor mounting plate. For some reason I do not know or understand, the loader frame does not use those bolts and the ears were cut off my mounting plate. The parts book for the loader shows a 'Deflection Limiting Strap' going from side to side under the engine and what looks like a plate and pad in the center. I presume this was to support the engine by the oil pan but these parts were missing from my tractor and I have no idea why the support was changed by the factory. Mine had no support for the motor in front of the crossmember near the flywheel. I made new ears and drilled holes to resupport the motor as it originally was without the loader. If anyone has photos or any other information or thoughts on this 'Deflection limiting Strap' I would appreciate receiving them.

I have already gotten a lot of good information from this forum and am sure I will get more in the future. I hope I can also be a useful contributor.

Don Young (North Central Alabama, USA)

[BearCreek Majors]

Welcome aboard Don!
There is a scrap yard in Richland Center WI (near Madison) that I believe had one or more of these units. It’s been a few years since I was out there but I do remember seeing at least one unit that used the “external frame”.

L&M Salvage
608-647-3490


Pat

[R W]

If you look at the photos posted by Pascal you can see three bolts in the frame rail, just to the rear of the four holding the rail to the front crossmember. These bolts hold the front of the motor, going into holes in ears on the front motor mounting plate. For some reason I do not know or understand, the loader frame does not use those bolts and the ears were cut off my mounting plate.

To Quote From A Brochure Regaring The C & S Loadstar, which was made by Cranes & Shovels (Cranvel) of Melbourne.
Quote:
With the C & S Loadstar the front axle and axle yoke assembly are NOT attached to the Fordson Tractor and therefore Fordson castings and timing cases are relieved of shock loadings (End Quote).

[Dons62FSM]

Thanks for the lead, Pat. I may contact them to see what they have but shipping would be prohibitive on the frame rails and I have a lot of work into repairing these.

Thanks for the info, RW. I sorta suspected there might be some reason like that. Since my unit will only get light usage and the frame rails had apparently been broken and repaired several times I think a little extra support from the engine will work out. The original system put a lot of stress on the frame rails at the flywheel cross member. I might remove the front engine brackets if I could locate the proper 'Deflection Limiting Strap" and associated parts. I also have the frame rails greatly strengthened.

Don

[frode]

If you look at the photos posted by Pascal you can see three bolts in the frame rail, just to the rear of the four holding the rail to the front crossmember. These bolts hold the front of the motor, going into holes in ears on the front motor mounting plate. For some reason I do not know or understand, the loader frame does not use those bolts and the ears were cut off my mounting plate.

To Quote From A Brochure Regaring The C & S Loadstar, which was made by Cranes & Shovels (Cranvel) of Melbourne.
Quote:
With the C & S Loadstar the front axle and axle yoke assembly are NOT attached to the Fordson Tractor and therefore Fordson castings and timing cases are relieved of shock loadings (End Quote).

This also the case on my County Super-4. I have seen it done on most of the setups here that use an exteranl frame. This is common when fitting a front blade, loader og backhoe.

[Wyomiles]

OK I didn't get much further but I did get things a little straighter in my own mind after all of your excellent advise.
I do have a double pully so if I drill new holes in the side frame and line up the new pump pully I should be able to get the belt drive going on the pump. Here is the snag, the double pully has a U-joint attachement, (front PTO ?) coming off of it. I am assuming that I will need to take this apart from the pullys to get the belt on ?



Then if I use the old hydraulic ram mount instead of the new bracket that came with the kit, I should be able to get this thing working. Snag number two is figuring out how to mount the new ram on the old mount.



This is really turning into a bigger job than this non mechanic has ever tried to tackle. I sure wish one of you guys lived in my area. Anybody want to take a vacation to Wyoming?

[marcusgs]

Hi, Just my thoughts on this interesting subject.

On the belt and front pulley, you will indeed need to take off the universal joint attached the the pulley to get the belt on, and while you're doing it I would fit a new fan belt too

If you mount your steering pump first you can use a piece of string to measure how long the new belt to drive it needs to be.

On the subject of the ram mounting, I'm not sure how the ball is fixed to the ram, if it's permanently attached then you will need to get a new one machined on a lathe, if it unscrews then it's simply a case of unscrewing and hopefully screwing into the new ram.

Otherwise it will be a case of cutting off and welding back onto the new ram.

Oh, and keep thinking positively, it will seem much easier if you do

Mark

[frode]

The ball is screwed onto the orginal ram. There is a locking pin going through it.

[BearCreek Majors]

If you dont have the back half of the "ball socket" you probably dont want to use the original ball and socket setup.

Sory for the kick in the gonads.

Pat

[Dons62FSM]

Wyomiles, that front pulley is for the original power steering pump belt. I have a working original setup just like that with the front mount hydraulic pump.

I do not want to hijack your thread but since you have the only tractor with loader frame like mine I have come across in several years, would it be possible for you to post some pictures of the support strap that goes from side to side under the engine, connecting the frame rails? I think it bolts on about 4 inches behind the big diagonal braces near the front of the rails, but I am not sure of that. I do have a parts book for the loader but the drawing is not good enough to tell just how it goes.

[Wyomiles]

Dons62 here are pictures of the underside of my tractor, hope this helps.


looking toward the rear.


front wheels


towards rear again

No more progress on the steering kit. I am wanting to finish up a project that I am working on and then I will take time to do some work on the tractor. So much to do , so little time.

[Dons62FSM]

Thanks a lot for the photos. I can see the support strap clearly in the second photo. It looks to be about 1/2" X 2" in size. I can also see what seems to be a sheet metal piece with ears between it and the motor. Can you tell if it has any kind of rubber pad or just how it interfaces with the motor? As I said, I have the parts book and it shows the piece with the ears and a similar piece without ears that it calls a "pad". Somehow, I assumed the piece with the ears was fastened to the motor and the pad fit between it and the support strap.

I hope you get the power steering working okay. Because of the accessory frame you are going to have to do some fabricating and I think you said the tractor was not near a shop. So you will probably have to move the tractor or the shop!!!

My power steering was really messed up but I managed to find enough pieces to get it working. I have my frame rails welded back together after much piecing and repairing so am starting to get it all back together. I think I can see where your frame rails have had reinforcing plates welded on in the offset area where mine were broken. Be sure to keep everything tightened up good, many bolts were missing on mine and nearly all of the holes had been tapped oversize and then stripped out again. I now have my frame rails totally boxed except the very front part and the crossmember under the flywheel is shortened to fit up to the boxing on the inside of the rail.

[Wyomiles]

It will be another month before I can get back up in the mountains to take another look underneath and see if I can answer your question.

[Dons62FSM]

Wyomiles, from your photos it looks like you do have several problems with that cylinder mounting. At the front, you may need to widen the front axle setting to get clearance from the cylinder to the frame. Since the new cylinder seems so much longer you will almost surely need to route the cylinder upward at the back to clear the loader support post, pretty much along the drag link. I think you will need a bracket somewhere around where the center cross member attaches to the bell housing.

To clear the cylinder, my frame has a cutaway area at the top outside where it turns down. My cylinder bracket was on top of the frame, rather than on the side like yours. The parts list drawing looks more like yours, so I do not know if mine was originally that way or not.

Too bad you can't get the original system working. There seems to be no real source of parts. Similar units were used on some British cars of the era, I think. I was able to find another cylinder and made one from the usable parts of the two.

[JonNWY]

I think this would be much easier to just fab up. Go the junk yard and get a saginaw pump and box from a 1/2ton. Then get a push pull RAM and some 3/8" plate. Mount the RAM to the axle and tie rod with some plate tabs. Then some plate to mount the pump kind of like in the pictures. Next pull the pitman arm off the box and drill/tap the reservoirs like the rock crawler guys do. Mount the box under the column area with a go kart chain gear to the steering shaft and run some lines. Bet the whole thing cost $150 US.

I'm sure plenty of smaller steering boxes would work as well since they already channel hydraulic pressure according to the input shaft. I cant see what this kit uses as input, just lines going under the cowl by the tank. I bet its some kid of selector just like this.

[woodcutter]

I'm after some advice on the agriline kits, I have a six cylinder major which i would like to fit with power steering but the engine only got a single pulley but my alternator has a double pulley could I run it with a short belt off alternator or would this not turn pump fast enough ? I may be able to mount it and run everything off one belt but until I buy the kit not sure. And has anybody got any good/bad points on these kits they sound quite cheap to me so I don't want to buy it if it's rubbish cheers any info or advice appreciated