Roadless and county crawler

[Roadless63]

Since this board was created I dont think Ive added any of my stuff, found a picture of my '63 roadless with '60 county crawler behind sitting on an old ww2 searchlight trailer converted into a lowloader. Roadless is still taxed as ag machine and is normally found pulling a baler round in summer time. It didnt do much this summer due to a noisy bearing in the gearbox (seems to be a weakness with roadless tractors).


This is the '64 winch tractor which has since had the cab and loader frame removed. Also in need of a bit of tlc......

[blue32]

Super nice...What wonderfull pictures.. - is the crawler drivable?? mybee moore pictures of them? Tell us moore about them...

mikkel

[Aussie Frank]

Wow two roadless tractors and a County My County is in pieces and I havn't even started to put together my Roadless front axle since I have had it's housing repaired let alone started on the rest of it.

If you can let me know a bit more about the bearing problems you are having I would greatly apreciate the information as I will in all likelyhood have to cast a new transfer box housing to get my tractor running. If there is a bearing that fails consistantly that is part of the Roadless transfer box I may have the possibility of upgrading to a bigger size when I make the new housing.

Also if you are getting inside your transfer box I would realy like you to measure some gears for me. I am trying to set up a database of information on gears and part numbers for the transfer boxes to try and match some of the later Ford 5000 gears back to the earlier E1A Major conversions. Some of the parts like shafts, bearings and flanges have identical part numbers so they cary over, but none of the gears do. I am trying to figure out if they changed the size of the gear teeth between the early and late transfer boxes. If they didn't then we may have a whole lot more spares available to us as I have found the later Ford 5000 parts a lot easier to get.

Regards, Frank.

[Roadless63]

Thanks for the comments! The crawler is fully drivable, in fact when things get wet it is the only thing which can move around in the field back home! It needs the correct drawbar frame fitting which I managed to find days before it was due to be scrapped! Also some of the lower track idlers have worn "tyres" (although steel, they are still termed as tyres since they are a press fit onto the rollers themselves) which can cause the track to jump off if turning sharply. Fortunately I picked up some new old stock rollers a few years back at the cambridge sales so this issue will be rectified. At some point the two track adjusting threaded rods have also been abused with stilsons and heat, probably beacuse it is not obvious where the locknut is located and the thread is a very fine pitch. Again we were lucky to find a source of N.O.S parts and the last 2 threaded rods on the shelf were purchased!

Roadless wise the biggest issue is with the main gearbox (ie fordson part) the extra torque that can be transmitted through the drivetrain wreaks havoc with the gearbox. As far as I know County did uprate the main transmission to cope with the even higher tractive effort produced by the crawler but the Roadless utilises standard gearbox/backend.

Frank I have a useful book titled "Roadless traction 4 wheel drive data book" Basically a workshop manual aimed at the 1000nd series fords but it openly references earlier tractors from time to time. It states that:
"Transfer gearbox ratios vary according to tyre size and on earlier production, interchangeability of tyre sizes is not provided for. On earlier production therefore, tyres which differ in size from those supplied as original equipment should not be fitted.
On more recent production however, a degree of interchangeability of tyre sizes is permissable and transfer gearboxes are now coded according to ratio. the code letter is stampedon the top edge of the rear flange of the transfer gearbox casing. Note that the code letter is repeated on each side of the tractor."
Code Front tyre rear tyre
a 9x24 12x38
b 9x24 14x30
e 10x24 12x38 standard equipment, other are optional
e 10x24 15x30
e 10x24 14x34

the rear tyres on option e are all interchangable

This would explain the different part numbers since the major based roadless normally had 9.5x24 front and 36" rear wheels or 14x30 optional. I have seen some roadless 6/4 on 38 rear wheels and the fronts are bigger to match.

[DeereOllie]

Aussie Frank.
I was just wondering how you were getting on having a new Roadless transfer box cast and machined? I've got a 1963 Super with a similiar aged 590E in it. I've just purchased a genuine Roadless 6/4 bonnet and front axle. Hence I've now had the idea of building a Roadless 6/4. However I know it's going to very, very difficult to find a genuine transfer box. Obviuosly if I can find one, great, but if you'r having a new one made, doing another at the same time may help the cost. I realise it's not going to be cheap sending it over to England, but it maybe a way of making it happen.
Cheers Ollie

[The Swanndri Guy]

DeereOllie, If you are going to build a Roadless 6/4, what colour would you paint it, the normal Fordson colours or the horrible early production colours ? TSG.

[Aussie Frank]

Hi Ollie.

Have you tried the guys at John Bownes Ltd. http://www.roadless.co.uk/ The last time I spoke to Richard in parts they had a transfer box that was missing the input shaft for sale. That was some time ago now so it might be sold already. They have the drawings to get replacements for the missing bits made. You might fall off you chair when you hear the price, but that is probably expected given that the parts are so hard to get.

I can certainly cast another housing for you, but unless you have all the internals it might cost more than a complete tractor by the time you made all the gears etc.. I managed to get a transfer box out of a Ford 5000 which has enough gears that can be adapted and a lot of the smaller parts are direct carry over from the earlier box. Without that as a start there is very little hope of making a complete box from scratch. I havn't done much on my roadless conversion. I have been too busy digging out trees and getting the site for my shed on my block ready so that I have somewhere to park my tractors. Lucky I have a tolerant wife, the back room and back yard have been full of Roadless axle and transfer box bits for ages now.

The prop shaft should be easy, just find your local WW2 CCKW wrecker and buy a front shaft off them and modify it to suit. I am not sure about the transfer box end drive flange, but I would bet that Roadless used surplus drive shafts as well as the axles because they were dirt cheap at the time. The Uni joints front and back are listed as the same part number so they will be from the USA and I can't see them casting and machining drive flanges to fit the prop shaft when surplus parts could be bought cheaply.

I have found good supliers for CCKW parts in the UK and Australia and I have parts lists for the early and later model conversions if you need part numbers. Send me a PM if you want details.

Regards, Frank.

[frode]

Is the transfer box the same as on the "conversion kit" that was sold for the major?

[DeereOllie]

Frank.
Thanks for the info. I did wonder about the Roadless guys, but havent rang them yet. At the moment I'm just putting the feelers out to see whats possible and try and get an idea of cost. After all, my tractor would not be an original Roadless, so although I'd love to build one, I do have to keep an idea on the cost and if I'd ever likely get my money back if I ever had to sell it. Thats not the idea before everyone gets excited, I'd build one because I've always wanted one, but I am practical enough to realise theres no point in spending more than I could buy one for. However I do believe that when fate throws you a hand, you have to at least have a good look.
As for colour, I haven't got a clue. The tractor is still being pulled apart to totaly rebuild the rather knackered transmission and final drive.
What I mean by the transfer box Frode, is the slim gearbox that was put between the standard Fordson belhousing and main gearbox with the lump hanging out of the LHS, to which the prop shaft to the front axle is driven by. All I have at the moment is a very good original long bonnet, and a rather knackered front drive axle, all of which I think is off a Roadless 6/4. I presume the conversion kit that Roadless and Selene sold included the front drive alxe, transfer box, longer bonnet and propshaft.
Talking of bonnets, my bonnet has a hole for the air cleaner stack pipe. However the bonnets that I have seen on Roadless 6/4's all seem to have no hole, and a side mounted larger oil bath air cleaner. Any ideas wise people of Fordsons etc?
Cheers Ollie

[frode]

Frank.
Thanks for the info. I did wonder about the Roadless guys, but havent rang them yet. At the moment I'm just putting the feelers out to see whats possible and try and get an idea of cost. After all, my tractor would not be an original Roadless, so although I'd love to build one, I do have to keep an idea on the cost and if I'd ever likely get my money back if I ever had to sell it. Thats not the idea before everyone gets excited, I'd build one because I've always wanted one, but I am practical enough to realise theres no point in spending more than I could buy one for. However I do believe that when fate throws you a hand, you have to at least have a good look.
As for colour, I haven't got a clue. The tractor is still being pulled apart to totaly rebuild the rather knackered transmission and final drive.
What I mean by the transfer box Frode, is the slim gearbox that was put between the standard Fordson belhousing and main gearbox with the lump hanging out of the LHS, to which the prop shaft to the front axle is driven by. All I have at the moment is a very good original long bonnet, and a rather knackered front drive axle, all of which I think is off a Roadless 6/4. I presume the conversion kit that Roadless and Selene sold included the front drive alxe, transfer box, longer bonnet and propshaft.
Talking of bonnets, my bonnet has a hole for the air cleaner stack pipe. However the bonnets that I have seen on Roadless 6/4's all seem to have no hole, and a side mounted larger oil bath air cleaner. Any ideas wise people of Fordsons etc?
Cheers Ollie

I know what a transfer box is. I was just wondering if is the same as the selene/roadless one

[Kiwi Kev]

What I mean by the transfer box, is the slim gearbox that was put between the standard Fordson belhousing and main gearbox with the lump hanging out of the LHS, to which the prop shaft to the front axle is driven by.

Actually, it goes between the gearbox and the rear transmission.

[DeereOllie]

Frode,
Sorry . I think it's the same sort of thing as the Selene kits. How I understand it, Selene came up with the idea, and gave Roadless the rights in the U.K.
Kev, doh

Ollie

[Matt 1944 N]

Most of the Selene "sandwich" or transfer boxes that I have seen are about an inch thick, whereas the Roadless ones are about 5 or 6 inches thick so I would imagine that the internal parts wouldnt be interchangeable

[brockwood]

a roadless and a county plus a few more of our toys all e27s
sorry cant get the pics to direct post try this link http://s1096.photobucket.com/albums/g32 ... oadles.jpg

[brockwood]

click on the next for the rest