A little puzzle.

Post by **Brian** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:27 am

I was out looking for a shed for my tractor collection and saw these!

What are they and where are they? No prizes just a bit of history still in use.

Bensdexta · Post by **Bensdexta** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 1:02 am

At Cardington - is that near enough to keep your tractors? Perhaps someone else can guess the use?
Thanks for the puzzle,
Ben

Meanderer · Post by **Meanderer** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 4:57 am

What a co-incidence!

My initial reaction was that we had sheds like those here for bulk storage of fertalizer at manufacturing. Then it hit me that a few months ago, I saw a documentary on "flight". Buildings like these, and maybe the same ones, were the hangars for Blimps or Airships. I'd never have guessed if I hadn't seen the old footage.

Obviously somewhere near you Brian?

Rick

JC · Post by JC » Sat Feb 28, 2009 6:13 am

I would have guessed some type of aircraft hanger, Rick, but I never would have thought of lighter than air craft.
Thanks for the puzzle, Brian.

Post by **Brian** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 10:18 am

Yes, they are the airship sheds at Cardington where the R101 was built and housed and from where she took off on her fateful maiden flight to India. She had problems with low power from her diesel engines and water-logging in her covering canvas. She could not gain enough height because of her load and crashed into a hillside in France, killing all but three (I think) on board.The British equivalent of the "Hindenburg".

The author, Nevile Shute worked in the design office and of course Barnes Wallace the aircraft designer, was also employed there.

The sheds are still in use. Experimental lighter than air craft and light aircraft fly in their interior. (Yes they really are that huge). They have also been used for filming.

Interestingly there is a Norfolk connection. The hanger on the right was originally built and sited at Norfolks own airship base at Pulham Market. This was the base of such airships as the R38. When the aerodrome closed as airships lost favour, the shed was dismantled and re built at Cardington.

In the village there is the communal grave of all who perished in the R101.

I was in the village carrying out a training course on Health and Safety.

Post by **Oscar** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 10:43 am

I believe they filmed a lot of the last two Batman films in sheds like those. They're massive.

Bensdexta · Post by **Bensdexta** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 1:16 pm

The Cardington sheds are a legacy of 3 brothers born nearly 130 years ago - the Short Brothers who built the first shed during WWI to build airships for the Admiralty. Shorts was the first aircraft company in the world, now owned by the Canadians

(Bombardier). The brothers started building balloons in the 1890's.

Of course Shorts went on to build thousands of heavier than air craft, but not at Cardington, including the innovative Empire Flying Boat which brought new standards of passenger and mail service on the Empire routes to South Africa and Australia. They developed the Empire design into the famous Sunderland maritime patrol flying boat which served with distinction around the world throughout WWII and afterwards, in New Zealand until 1967 when my Dexta was already 6 - aarh the days when Britain had a manufacturing industry!

All the best,
Ben

Meanderer · Post by **Meanderer** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 1:57 pm

Bensdexta wrote:Of course Shorts went on to build thousands of heavier than air craft, but not at Cardington, including the innovative Empire Flying Boat which brought new standards of passenger and mail service on the Empire routes to South Africa and Australia. .....................
Ben

Ben,
You brought back another fine memory for me. I think it was in 1952 that I remember going to Rose Bay on Sydney harbour to see my Grandmother fly out to Auckland NZ to visit our Rels there. She flew on a Empire via Qantas Empire Airways! A wonderful sight. Unbeknown to a lot of Sydney siders, the Rose Bay Sea Plane Base is still in operation today!
I've always wondered what it would feel like during take-off and landing.

A preview of what is at this site : http://www.airwaysmuseum.com/Rose%20Bay ... ar%201.htm

Bensdexta · Post by **Bensdexta** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 3:39 pm

Thanks for the note - exciting days, I love the Art Deco passenger terminal and wonder if it still exists. My wife's uncle now 102, was an Imperial Airways pilot on the Empire flying boats. 'Imps' crews handed over to Qantas at Singapore for the Oz legs. Aircrew were away from UK for a month, 2 weeks out 2wks return. Of course the planes did the round trip much quicker.
It's a shame that the likes of the Short brothers are thin on the ground in UK now. Not sure why that is? Of course we have Posh & Becks and lots of clever bankers instead

Ben

Post by **Brian** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 11:17 am

I don't think Shorts were involved with the airships at Cardington.

There were two built there. R100 which was designed and manufactured by Vickers and R101 which was constructed under the control of the Air Ministry as a government backed and designed unit.

The frames for both ships were built in Norwich at Boulton and Pauls works there. Barnes Wallace designed the structure for the R100 and his method, the geodectic design, became the reason for the success of the Vickers Wellington aircraft.

My father, during his service days in the RAFR, was posted for a short while to the Sunderland base at Stranrar in Scotland and the harbour where we start our journeys to Holland was also a large seaplane base.

Bensdexta · Post by **Bensdexta** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 12:14 pm

Brian wrote:I don't think Shorts were involved with the airships at Cardington.

Hi,
According to Wiki, Shorts built the R31 & R32 at Cardington which flew at the end of WWI. They also built the nearby township of Shortstown for their workers. In 1919 Cardington was nationalised as the Royal Airship Works. As Brian says, later the ill-fated Government designed R101 was built at Cardington but the competing and successful Vickers R100 was built at Howden in Yorkshire. R100 flew to Toronto

and back in 1930 before being scrapped in 1931, after the R101 disaster in Oct 1930.
All the best,
Ben

Post by **Brian** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 2:46 pm

You are right Ben, Shorts owned the site but it was taken over by the Government company. R100 was indeed built in Yorkshire. You learn something every day!

Bensdexta · Post by **Bensdexta** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 3:25 pm

Brian,
You mentioned the R38, also built at Cardington, I think Shorts originally won the order from the Admiralty for this + 3 sisterships. All were initially cancelled after WWI, but the R38 was reprieved to be sold to the Americans. Tragically in 1921 before she could make the crossing to the US, she broke up due to a structural weakness whilst manoeuvring over the Humber, with the loss of 16 US and 28 UK lives. 5 survived.
All the best,
Ben

Tmac · Post by **Tmac** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 4:01 am

Well those are quite the Blimp hanger. I would have guessed that had the cat not been out of the bag by now. They always seem to come in pairs too.

There were two of those big blimp hangers out at Tillamook Naval Air Station Oregon. These hangers are 1000 ft long near 200 ft high and near 200 ft wide at the footing. These buildings, there is only one now, the other burned in the early 90s, are still the largest all wooden buildings in the USA. I think they are listed in the records G-book as that.

For years then at the time, late 60s, I always had a hankering to just fly a plane through one. So as I was working on a guys plane, I had a air repair station then, I got to thinking that he had just brought in the perfect plane to do just that with. I was doing the finish assembly on it after it was built from several old ones that had been used for crop dusting in the late 30s to the 50s. He got them in the early 60s from out of Portland Oregon. This was a 1933 WACO-UBF-2, commonly referred to as a F-2, powered by a R-220 Continental. These planes weren't all that big, and had the STOL capabilities of a lot of current modern planes.

While I hatched up this scheme to do this I knew he was a old boy game for some good adventure.Now, I say "old boy" he must of been all of 50 or so!;) Heck Iam a lot older now then he was then.
So I run it by the guy. This scheme of mine to fly his, years to build, just built plane through this big hanger. Well he said he was game, he knew I could handle better than him. I had put about 30 hrs or so on it in testing, and I had already, wrung it out.

The big day for the fly through was up. Me and him left Eugene for Tillamook. A short flight, a couple hrs in route with a few rolls and loops on the way him flying, on a great Sunday, clear as a bell, late in May of 70. He was green with this plane and still needed the practice.

Here was the plan, he was in the passenger hole, we land, he gets out, I turnaround and take off again. He was to go in the hanger afoot, check out all the clearances end to end like no obstructions or witnesses/gawkers period or anyone going to move the doors. He had 2 flags in his pocket one red, one white. I just kept circling the field as if I was shooting touch and go landings. When he was finished clearing the hanger he was to come out where I could see him. If it was a no go, he would hold up the red flag, if it was all clear he had wave a white flag. Well when he got to where I could see him, after walking the hanger, there he was waving the white flag like a mad man. I give him my signal, a wing waggle, that I was ready. I made one more pattern flight around the field, that was to position myself so that I could come in the building form opposite end of him where he was on the flight ramp. The plan was to land as close to him as possible, so he could jump in after I came through on the first run. When he was in, he was to let me know if he wanted a trip through to, said he did. Since I could get that plane off in in really a short distance, I just turned towards the hanger took off and flew through. When we got out of there, that old boy was so giddy he was like he was smoking on wakkay tabbacy or something.

Well the whole plan went off without a hitch, 2 trips through that building. I did later, even though there were no solid witnesses to this totally illegal stunt, get a visit from the FAA

(. Never owned up to it though to them, coarse they knew different, or I may still be in jail! I did get to do it again, with the same plane a couple more times, legally, hired for a TV ad for tourism! They heard about it from someone there though. Now that paid a few bucks!

Meanderer · Post by **Meanderer** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 4:28 am

That's a good'n' Tom! I enjoyed it very much. Make's your story look like "Biggles" and Brian's like "Bob the Builder"

I've met and known a few famous people in my life ....... now I'm going to add your name to the list!

(along with Brian's of course)

PS>
Has anyone noticed the very bad mistake in the coloured Qantas Poster image above? (No prizes this time either)

Aussie Frank · Post by **Aussie Frank** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 6:06 am

Hi Rick,

That looks like the strangest Aussie flag I have ever seen. Billowing in the breeze aside I think the red and white stripes in the union jack shouldn't fall down even with artistic license.

Regards, Frank.

P.S. Brian if they ever want to relocate one of those sheds and you can't find a spot to put it, I have a few acres in Snake Valley. Now Tom if that were to ever happen you are more than welcome to fly through it before I park the tractors in it.

Meanderer · Post by **Meanderer** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 6:13 am

Right on Frank. I really can't comprehend how that could have passed by the powers that be at the time. Let alone that none of our British collegues have commented before this. That part of the flag is theirs, eh.

JC · Post by JC » Sun Mar 08, 2009 8:36 am

That's a great story, Tom. When I was in Tillamook, there was an air museum with a huge hanger. Is that the same one? I was going to stop in, but it was closed by the time I was through loading my tractor. My pilot buddies tell me that its OK to fly a fixed-wing through a hanger, but don't try it with a helicopter. You will keep going up until you hit the roof, no matter how far you lower the collective pitch. Apparently one of their friends tried it for himself!

Mark · Post by **Mark** » Mon Mar 09, 2009 3:51 am

Wow, Tom, that was a great story. Didn't know you was a dare devil pilot, and a Fordson Man. That's a great combination!

Tmac · Post by **Tmac** » Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:00 am

JC: Yes that is the one! At that time there were 2 of those big Blimp/Dirigibles hangers there. One burned down in the early 90s. Those hangers were positioned in an "L" shaped layout. I dont know the designation of the one that burnt, or the one I flew through, so I dont know if it is the one now, with the Air museum. They were called Hanger "A" and Hanger "B" in the order they were built.

Now I know of only one flight of a helicopter in a hanger. It was done for the first test flight of a home made one in the early 60s but it was tethered to the floor. I wasnt there and only heard about it, but I knew who the guys were. That one was only given about 1Ft of slack. The 2 guys that built it were neither licensed A&Ps or had ever flown any aircraft. They had a machine shop they were machinists. The Helicopter they built would fly, but couldn't get an approval for a certificate. Those guys didn't know any better and brazed the whole airframe together instead of welding it. ;(

But you think of it and that really makes sense. Like a piece of paper stuck on the back of a fan. Except in this instance the fan is the mobile part!

Mark: I bought my first aircraft when I was still in HS, 35 years before I owned my first tractor. That was a Bensen Gyro copter. I never flew it, my Dad refused to let me. That one I got, had already nailed one guy. I bought it, me and one of my friends pushed it home down the road.

The next plane I bought was a modified Cessna 170, when I graduated form HS. I flew that plane for 2 years on package/cargo runs throughout Wa & Or. While attending A&P school. Most days I would just taxi up to the school. I went on package runs hours before school started at 7AM.

In the late 60s me and one of my airplane buddies bought a 100 acres and built our own commercial airport. We had 4000 ft of unpaved runway with a air repair station, flight school and air charter service there. In the summers I flew in air shows all over Wa and Or. Mostly podunk places, but also hit the Paine Field Airfair, that sported the US AF T-birds and Abottford Can that had the Can equivalent of the T-Birds. I also made a few exhibitions in Sport Biplane races.

I have built 10 times as many of aircraft as I have tractors.

For the most part I had aerobatics training long before I had any instrument training required for a Private Pilots license. Aerobatics is not required. Even the easiest and one of the most dangerous situations, the accidental "Spin" is not required training even for a commercial pilot Rating.

Oh by the way that building was NOT the first I ever flew through just the biggest. I could say that I had a lot of practice before hand.

Mark · Post by **Mark** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 3:20 am

Tom,
Another great story, but Tom we need pictures, lots of pictures, surely you have some

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